Video: Chief Engineer Says ZL1 Is 'Not About Horsepower Alone'

Comparison test..........here we go!

Looks like Ford stole your thunder you cry baby bitches. Ford is sick of hearing about Vettes and copycat Camaros the way I am. If you're serious go racing and stop with the gum flapping already, you stole the pony car idea and now you think you're entitled to be the fastest too. To me it's disturbing to see the Camaro outsell the Mustang month after month. I like that, it's not about HP, it's not about HP because your old fashioned push-rod motors can't make that much HP per liter, you whiney bitch. The truth is your ZL1 will get killed by the new GT500 and then you'll resort to your 2 seater that costs 50% more to beat it, and then like Chevy fans you'll brag about your superior cars.

Sure, AL, HP is never relevant when comparing muscle cars ;)

Power always matters in this particular segment, and I think this guy is disingenuous. The point of a pony/muscle car is to bring intoxicating power. Granted, we'd like them to handle the twisty stuff well too, but the trade off has always been handling for power. An Elise or an RX-8 (or, I'd wager, the FT-86/BRZ) will always, ALWAYS, feel more fun in the twisties than a Camaro. And that's all I care about because I don't live my life (regrettably) on a track. The real world demands I take my fun where/when I can find it, in a responsible manner, avoiding tickets along the way.

The Camaro isn't all about looks either right :)

I'd buy a V6 stang over the ZL-1 or any other Camaro just based on the looks and the outward visibility.

It's still a "muscle car" from an "American" (well, at least with main headquarters located on USA territory, as far as you can define such thing) car manufacturer and this car is mostly targeted towards USA market, so yea, power DOES matter, and matters more than anything else, especially silly things like "handling" and "braking". So that GM person is really being dishonest and sounds like he's doing a lame attempt at "damage control".

Yeah I think HP still matters in the Pony Car areana, but, this is a specialty model. The Camaro SS still makes more power than a Mustang GT, and that's where the numbers are. Shelby GT500's aren't all over the road, and ZL1's won't be either.

And Sohcammer: Dude you can rag on GM's motors all you want, but let's face it, they win more races than ford's OHC engines, no contest. Heck even Fords most popular motor, the 5.0 (the one everybody uses to go racing) uses pushrods. You can rant and rave about HP/liter or "new technology" like OHC all you want, and at the end of the race, you'll still be looking at the tailpipes of a GM powered car.

scubowtie,
In what series do these engines compete in the same class?

GM made the classic blunder of bench-marking their car to their competitor. This is a terrible strategy because it almost always ultimately leaves you a step behind your competition. So I'm glad that Ford pulled the rug out from under them and stole the ZL1's spotlight.

And the response to the situation that GM now find themselves in? I find it to be extremely hilarious. I mean, just look at the statement "The ultimate in cornering, braking and acceleration -- which is really what this segment is all about"...I don't think he has any clue what his market segment is if he actually believes that people in this market segment are not supposed to care that the GT500 has 650 hp compared to the ZL1's 580 HP.

Even if prospective buyers didn't care about the power difference, why is it assumed that the ZL1 is going to corner better and stop faster? IRS and fancy magnetic dampeners? Maybe, but I'm not drinking that GM fanboy koolaide just yet. Previous GT500's have been no slouch in the handling and stopping department, so I'll hold out until I see what each of these are capable of.

Its just sour grapes.....GM still has a horrible inferiority complex over going BK when arch enemy Ford did things the right way and is doing really well. Ford is in it to win and wont let GM get much of an edge in ANY product line.

bodyblue: I wonder, then, why GM still commands a higher market share than Ford if Ford's vehicles are so much better? Ford may be able to maintain the quality advantage in the relative near-term, but GM's higher sales numbers translates to higher profit and a better ability to reinvest that profit in their products... which should produce higher quality vehicles. Assuming it's the sort of quality consumers want.

explorerx4: If I have to tell you, you are to new to the world of grass roots racing. But to broaden your horizons, GM and Ford V8's (talking about the modern ones such as the LS series and Fords 4.6 and 5.0's) compete in almost every class of drag racing except the top Pro levels, so they compete in classes like Outlaw 10.5, bracket classes, Worlds fastest street car, etc. They also compete in Autocross classes, different classes of Rock Crawling, Rock Racing, etc. They are used in vehicles for races like the Baja 500/1000. There are also events like Holley's LS Fest, that features cars of all makes that compete in drag/autocross/0-60-0 competitions all in one event.

"Ford may be able to maintain the quality advantage in the relative near-term, but GM's higher sales numbers translates to higher profit and a better ability to reinvest that profit in their products..."

I disagree with this statement. Higher sales volume/market share does not necessarily translate into profits. GM for decades led in market share and went bankrupt - because the market wouldn't pay enough money for their cars. They can easily sell cars, what's tough is selling competitive cars for enough of a gross margin on each one to make the whole operation profitable.

We too often focus simply on sales volume, but it's profit-per-sale that's really important.

There might be a shred of credibility in Al's statement if the Camaro had already proven itself to be a better handling car than the Mustang. But it hasn't and Ford seems intent on keeping the Shelby a step ahead of the Camaro, power, technology and handling wise. No reason why the new Shelby won't equal or better the ZL1 on the skidpad and road as well as the dragstrip. The biggest question is at what price point? The 2012 GT500 with Recaro's is almost a 56k car, I can't imagine Ford pouring all this additional technology in (Carbon Fiber driveshaft??? Bilstein driver-adjustable dampers??? Wow!) without adding 5k to the price. At 61k, you're getting into some thin air that GM swears the ZL1 won't break. We'll see...

"I wonder, then, why GM still commands a higher market share than Ford if Ford's vehicles are so much better?"

Simple...more brands....and Jay is exactly correct above....volume hides a ton of problems in profitability but always bites a company in the ass in the long run if its cars are not good ones. When Mulally took Ford over he came right out and said "Ford has to get smaller to get better". They slowed production and raised prices over the past few years and it has worked. People will pay for a premium product.....and some people on here wonder how Ford can demand what they do for their cars. Look at the median prices for Explorers.....it surprised even Ford at how many of the upper trim levels they sell.

GM has lost 3/5s of its business it had in 2000, 5 million vehicles down to 2 million in 2010. The gap has narrowed significantly between Ford and Chevy. Not only that GM as you know declared bankruptcy and needed federal bailout money just to keep from being sold for scrap. GM defaulted on 77.5 billion in debt it owed and needed another 49.5 billion in government money just to stay in business. GMs profit margin is thnner than Ford's, Ford in fact is more profitable than GM even though it sells fewer cars by only a couple hundred thousand. Ford is honoring its obligations and making more money too, and is in fact not only competing with Chevy but Chevy and the federal government and doing it successfully i might add.

Ford Claims Fourth NHRA Manufacturers Cup
November 15, 2011

Several Ford drivers talk about Ford claiming its fourth NHRA Manufacturers Cup in history in 2011.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zz0QOmFZcDA&feature=uploademail

"it's not about HP because your old fashioned push-rod motors can't make that much HP per liter, you whiney bitch"-sohcammer (I'm guessing as in Ford Single Overhead Cam)

Yep Ford really is killing it, it's first win since 1982... oh, and they did it with old fashioned push-rod motors that can't make that much HP per liter, you whiney .... It's cool though, I mean most of those cars at least slap a Mustang sticker on the front.

"Ford Motor Company earned its first NHRA Manufacturers Cup since 1982 and its fourth ever behind the efforts of wins, runner-ups, and No. 1 qualifiers in the Funny Car, Pro Stock, Super Stock, and Stock categories. The Blue Oval also brought home the title in 1964 and 1965. It is the second such award earned by Ford’s iconic Mustang model in a major racing series this year.

“This is a special honor to accept in a special year at Ford,” said Jamie Allison, director of Ford Racing, who accepted the award during the NHRA Full Throttle Drag Racing Series Awards Ceremony Nov. 14. “The Manufacturers Cup is another honor in what has been a truly remarkable year at Ford Racing.”

Two weeks ago, Ford also clinched its first NASCAR Nationwide Series Manufacturers Championship since 2002 with the Ford Mustang."

http://www.nhra.com/story/story.aspx?F_y=2011&F_m=11&F_d=17&CustomURL=ford-wins-2011-nhra-manufacturers-cup&AspxAutoDetectCookieSupport=1

bowtiebitch

The ZL1 produces 93.5 hp per liter and weighs in at 4120

The 2013 GT500 produces 112.1 hp per liter and weighs in at 3850

According to the official lap times at Willow Springs, my local track, the 2011 Shelby Mustang has posted a faster lap time than a 2008 ZR1, and a ZO6/ZO7,

Ford Mustang Shelby GT500, 1:23.48

Chevrolet Corvette ZR1, 1:23.87

Chevrolet Corvette ZO6 ZO7, 1:24.28

Nissan GT-R, 1:25.09

Fastestlaps

I think team Corvette had a couple bad days, don't you agree?

Here's a Boss Mustang with a bolt-on Vortech that'll walk a ZR1 for less than half the price,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Il5UWVMWGuc

The Super Cobra Jet holds the world record for the quickest Production car ever produced,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CxhzWhXc3U

Consider this, Hennesseys top ZR1 pkg produces 121 hp per liter
Hennesseys top Ford GT pkg produces over 185 hp per liter

Here's a video of a Boss Mustang with a Kenne Bell 2.8 producing 186 hp per liter, at what cost?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wu8_380WJeM&feature=related

Here's a video of SVTs chief engineer talking about the 2013 GT500 at the LA Auto Show

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QsZdG16-V8

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/lightning-lap-2011-ndash-feature-ndash-car-and-driver-sortable-times-complete-lightning-lap-times-2006-to-2011-page-8

I can't verify you're local lap times, but I can trust car and driver.

Let's see, I count 7 Corvette's including the base model with faster lap times than the '11 Shelby GT 500. Now I know that doesn't include the '12 or the yet to be released '13 car you are so happy about, but seems like GM is doing just fine. Oh, and don't forget that top ranked Mosler 900S uses, wait for it, a GM LS engine. And if you want to talk about Hennessey tuned engines, the Venom GT puts out 193 hp/liter out of 6.2 liter GM LS engine.

http://www.venomgt.com/the-venom-gt/specifications/

You can babble and compare a car that's still 2 years out to current products all you want, but there are more GM motors, putting out more power, in more racecars and streetcars than any Ford motor, let alone any Ford motor with overhead cams.