A Letter to Camaro Faithful, Re: 2013 Shelby GT500

That's funny, since he hasn't driven the gt500. Shouldn't count your eggs before they hatch, as they say.

Last I checked the only reason the camaro exists is the mustang, so who should be thanking who?

"The days of "no replacement for displacement," are over"

Doesn't... the ZL1 have a bigger engine? Or am I crazy?

What a joke. Even when the GT was around 300hp and the SS was around 400, the GT STILL gave the Camaro a run for its money on the track! The Camaro is too damn heavy. Not to mention that I couldn't live with one as a daily-driver because you can't see anything out the back and the windshield is so low that my eyes are almost in line with the visors!

Bets on him eating is words come March 2012 when someone gets these two cars on VIR or Laguna Seca?

Traction-Management and Magnetic Ride Control are cute; but they're not going to overcome the obvious performance advantages of 450 less pounds, 100 more horsepower and stickier tires. While its true these days that there are 'replacements for displacement' (because yes, his engine is the bigger one...) Everyone still has to play by the same rules of physics.

He's wasting his time, the Camaro faithful don't know how to read.

Wow. Different kinda buyers. Not a big fan of either car but having driven a Camaro I'd avoid it like the plague as the outward visibility is akin to looking out of a tank. How can you track a car with no outward visibility?

None of this matters because on a track the driver wins the race not the car. I prefer the stang even if it had 550hp because its lighter and it probably more fun to drive. Theinterior is also LIGHT YEARS ahead of the Camaro. The magnetic ride control is no joke though. The ZL1 is going to drive MUCH smoother everyday than the GT500. The magnetic ride is that is the one area where Ford cant touch Chevy. I also dont believe him about listening to the consumers. If he did the ZL1 would have a recaro seat/racing seat option like the stang. So would the corvette for that matter. They did change the steering wheel but took it out of the Volt. Are you kidding me??? How hard is it to make real sports seats and a nice 3 spoke sterring wheel? Why cant they EVER get this right. If they listened the camaro and vette would have both had great seats and sterring wheels over 10 years ago. What a BS artist like all of them.

Lastly if he wants to go by sales does that mean the Camaro eas playing catch up in the past when it was easily outsold by the mustang? Why didnt he or someone at chevy admit to that back then? They are the ones who stopped making the camaro and lost pontiac while ford was selling mustangs easily and not taking government money. Wake up Al O.

I'm betting Chevy is looking into secretly upping the power as we speak.
They will still claim 580, but like many of the old 276hp Japanese cars from the early 90s, it will actually make quite a bit more.

Considering the ZL1's engine is a detuned version of the Corvette ZR1's 638 hp engine, I don't think Chevy has to secretly look for ways to up the power. Not to mention it is a forced induction LS-series engine, these engines are tuned to insane power levels all the time. Slap a slightly smaller blower pulley on there, tweek the ECU and GM can spit out whatever HP they want. At this point it's more politics than technology. They didn't want to diminish the ZR1 by selling another car with the exact same engine, and they had enough to edge out the current top dog Mustang. Of course it's all a moot point, because it's really going to come down to who puts the power to the ground the best.

UPDATE 11/15/11: Chevrolet has finally unveiled the official specifications and pricing for the 2012 Camaro ZL1. The muscle car can accelerate from 0 to 60 mph in 3.9 seconds with an automatic gearbox (4.0 seconds with a manual) and can reach a top speed of 184 mph. More importantly, it goes on sale at a starting price of $54,995, including Performance Traction Management and Magnetic Ride suspension.

2012 Normally Aspirated 5.0L Ford Boss Mustang, 0-60 in 3.9s

2011 Shelby GT350, 0-60 in 3.7s, 12.0s flat 1/4 mile, 1.05G skidpad, and that's with the 525 hp tune not the 624 hp tune, and all of it Bone Stock as tested by Motor Trend.

Chevy fans can jaw jack all they want it's not going to make their Camaro any faster on paper.

Actually, I think this letter is a good strategy. Let's their own fans know they're not asleep at the wheel, and being better than Ford is important to GM faithful.

I also suspect that the Camaro will be the faster track car of the two, even though for my money I'd probably prefer the visibility and looks of the Mustang.

GM should push this track challenge idea though perhaps at VIR or Road Atlanta (vs Nurburgring) as a marketing strategy as well. Best case for them is Ford declines and then they can crow about it ad nauseum.

@csubowtie:

Actually its an UPtuned version of the LSA, not a detuned LS9. But either way, yes there is additional power available if GM wanted to dip into it. But their problem is that they can't sell a Camaro with more power than the Corvette...its just not going to happen.

They need to find a way to crash diet the Camaro to something around 3900lbs. Its too fat to be competitive. Funny to think that a '69 Camaro with the 427 engine weighed a lofty 3,135 lbs. We sure did get fat as a country.

Wonder how much abuse the ZL1 motor can take stock. It's not as forged as some would want it to be.

The Camaro is a direct rip-off of the Mustang, twice.

The days of "no replacement for displacement," are over, you mean the days of Ford taking a back seat in performance to Chevy in the pony class it created are over, you crooks.

We'll see if the ZL1's superior technology and sophistication can overcome the GT500's over 300 lb weight advantage on the race track.

We'll see if the ZL1's superior technology and sophistication can overcome the GT500's 70 hp advantage on the race track.

The GT500's Torsen differential puts more power down than the ZL1's IRS.

OHV engines are unstable at high rpm.

The ZL1 is subject to the gas guzzler tax as it gets an epa 12 mpg city driving it economically and the 650 hp GT500 believe it or not is not subject to the gas guzzler tax.

The Camaro may be outselling the Mustang month after month, but Ford's not going to be beat on the race track, they're out to kill the copycat Camaro, and it's their Shelby Mustang that puts out more power than Chevy's halo car the ZR1, with a smaller engine for half the price.

The laws of physics apply everywhere in the universe, even planet earth, unless you belong to the Chevy universe.

I like that GM is punching back, but on a racetrack the solid rear axle really isn't a liability.

The Mustang GT 5.0 turned a 3:06.6 lap in C&D's 2011 Lightning Lap. The GT500 turned a 3:04. In 2009 (CD didn't bring the Camaro in 2011 because it was unchanged from the 2010 model they tested previously) the Camaro ran a 3:09.5 on the same track.

There is no reason to think that the ZL1 will be able to out run a GT500 on the track.

they should be very evenly matched. ford has a weight an horsepower advantage; chevy employs a more sophisticated suspension. if ford was to run this on the nurburgring, i'd suspect it'd clock something along the lines of the zl1's 7:41 time.

All I can say is the ZL1 weighs too much, and the GT500 doesn't have the technology necessary to sustain track performance. It's easier to reduce the ZL1's weight than it is to add a comparable Magnetic Ride Suspension, Negative/Neutral Lift, Oil Coolers, etc on the Mustang.

Neither car is ideal, however the ZL1 will be easier/cheaper to modify for more ideal conditions (i.e. lowering weight). There's already carbon fiber doors, hoods, trunks, etc. aftermarket components for the ZL1.

The Mustang will probably cost more too, especially with "track-ready" options.

One way or another this will be a Classic Pony Car Battle...

To say the mustang cant handle a track is false or is unsophisticated is false the tuning they have done to that suemsion is amazing it out handles an m3 for christs sake

The ZL1 is cheaper and easier to modify, spoken like a true Chevy Idiot. The upgraded TVS that sits on top of the 5.8L Ford can produce up to 20 psi of boost, compared with the 2011s supercharger that produces up to 14 psi of boost, Ford Racings TVS supercharger on the 2011 5.4 has shown it can produce up to 850 hp on pump gas with the stock long block, the ZR1 can handle about 755 hp before the engine starts to complain. This new 5.8L should be able to produce up to 900 hp on pump gas without even a blower change.

“SVT keeps the Shelby GT500 on the cutting edge of technology and takes muscle car performance to new heights,” said Jost Capito, director of Global Performance Vehicles and Motorsport Business Development. “We encapsulated every aspect of performance in this car – whether it’s 0-60, top speed, racetrack or quarter-mile times. Beyond that, the daily driver also will find this car perfectly fits his or her needs.”

The 5.8-liter V8 aluminum-block engine produces 650 horsepower and 600 lb.-ft. of torque, making it the most powerful production V8 in the world. The 3,850-pound car also stays exempt from the gas-guzzler tax.

Nearly every part of the powertrain has been optimized for producing the additional horsepower, including a new supercharger, new cross-drilled block and heads, updated camshaft profiles, a new carbon fiber driveshaft and upgraded clutch, transmission and axle.

A larger, more-efficient supercharger flowing more air through the engine is key to helping produce the massive 650 horsepower. The new TVS series 2300 creates 2.3 liters of displacement and is a unique design to the 5.8-liter engine.

The entire cooling system has been significantly updated on the new 5.8-liter engine. It now includes a larger cooling fan, fan shroud with high-speed pressure-relief doors, a more efficient charge air cooler, a higher-flow intercooler pump and an intercooler heat exchanger with volume increased 36 percent.

Revised gearing

Nearly every gear on the 2013 Ford Shelby GT500 was revised to manage the torque and use more of the power in a way that makes it more driver-friendly. Engineers considered more than 35 gearing combinations, finally deciding on one that delivers less torque all the way through the wheels to the ground and still enables the car to achieve fuel economy targets.

A key piece of the driveline, the six-speed manual transmission, offers upgraded gears, bearings and housing so it can properly manage the torque. The final drive ratio is now 3.31:1 for optimized overall vehicle gearing to complement the massive torque. Every gear besides fourth was optimized for competing performance metrics. The clutch has increased torque and rpm capacity and uses a dual-disc design.

“It might just seem like we’re putting a bigger engine into the car. But it’s been a balanced approach through and through,” said Jamal Hameedi, SVT chief engineer. “We’ve completely redone the car to be even more sophisticated in terms of handling and control than the prior model.”

Other keys for improved traction management include:
•Torsen limited-slip differential:When customers order the optional Performance Package, they will get a Torsen limited-slip differential that helps the rear suspension deliver maximum torque and traction better and longer under track conditions
•Launch control: A new launch control system lets drivers set the desired launch rpm depending on tire temperature, street surface or other conditions. Unique to SVT’s launch control is that it is integrated with both the engine control and traction control
•Brembo braking system: A new Brembo brake system offers drivers enhanced stopping power to help keep their car under control, both on the road and the track. New six-piston calipers in front along with larger front and rear rotors help improve brake fade. New brake pads that are more aggressive also help the car achieve high deceleration and further robustness for more driver confidence

Aero advancements

Significant aerodynamic work was done on the new Shelby GT500 to ensure the car has proper downforce for optimum performance at all speeds. Engineers were able to determine how to harness the air that was moving around and through the car to improve the cooling system, maximize downforce and minimize drag.

The front fascia and splitters were modified to handle the extreme loads at 200 mph, resulting in a car that tracks more securely and feels more planted to the road at higher speeds. It offers 33 percent more effective aero loading at 160 mph compared to the 2011 model.

Superior ride

The new Shelby GT500’s driving dynamics have been improved, now working in concert with all the new content on the car.

Handling, all AdvanceTrac settings and steering assist levels within selectable steering have been tuned to account for the updated content. The previously available unique traction control system and electronic stability control settings help drivers achieve maximum performance on both the street and the track.

Both systems can be completely disabled in controlled track situations where maximum driver skill is utilized, or fully engaged for maximum safety during normal driving or in less-than-ideal traction conditions. Intermediate sport mode allows drivers to push their cars hard at the track without completely disabling the safety systems, permitting more aggressive driving before the traction control and electronic stability control intervene.

“We took a completely different approach with this car so drivers can choose their settings instead of a computer making the selection,” Hameedi said. “Nearly every system the driver interacts with can be tailored to his or her situation including the Bilstein electronic adjustable suspension, launch control, AdvanceTrac and steering assist levels.”

The 2013 Shelby GT500 offers two new sets of forged-aluminum wheels including a unique wheel for cars with the optional packages. The 19-inch front and 20-inch rear wheels are coupled with Goodyear Eagle® F1 SuperCar G: 2 tires on all vehicle configurations.

Taking it one step further

Sometimes Ford Shelby GT500 customers want to enjoy their car on surface streets. Other times they just want to let loose on the track. Two new optional packages on the 2013 model give them the choice.

Available as part of the optional Performance Package, SVT-designed Bilstein electronic adjustable dampers are accessed on the dash with a simple push of a button. Normal mode gives customers a more comfortable ride over road irregularities. Sport mode is all about performance, delivering improved response time on the track and less body roll while cornering and pitch under braking. The Torsen limited-slip differential also comes with the Performance Package.

“The adjustable shocks let us develop our car on the track without any compromise,” said Kerry Baldori, Ford SVT Global Performance Vehicles chief engineer. “Before, we had to tune the car with street implications in mind. Now we can go as extreme as we want on the track setting and still offer the customer a comfortable ride on the road.”

Enthusiasts can upgrade their Performance Package with an additional Track Package for all-out performance. The option comes with an external engine oil cooler, rear differential cooler and transmission cooler for further durability. The coolers play an essential role in preventing crucial components from overheating under high-speed conditions.

The 2013 Ford Shelby GT500 will be built at AutoAlliance International Plant in Flat Rock, Mich.

People on and on about the magnetic ride control need to remember it isn't chevys proprietary technology, it's Delphi's. If ford wants to use it, they can. Obviously they didn't have to. No doubt the camaro will be nicer to drive on the street, but nobody buys a gt500 expecting to ride on a cloud so who cares? The people who buy these cars are the ones who had the muscle cars back in the day with no attention to NVH whatsoever.

To add to this fan boy convo, ALL I want to say is why didn't Ford post the GT500's track time on the Nurburgring? They tested there, that's saying a little while saying a lot.

If the GT500 had a better lap time than the ZL1, Ford definitely would've advertised it!

It's interesting to see how people who have driven neither car are suddenly so knowledgeable about both.

We need to get both of these cars purchased off dealer lots and tested at Laguna Seca, Nurburgring, or both.

Sohcammer: You do realize that the TVS 2300 blower was used on the Corvette ZR1, and the Cadillac CTS-V before it was used on the Mustang in 2011, right? And where the hell did you hear that LSA's are complaining at 755hp. LS series engines have been pushed over 1000 hp and survive. In fact the Hennessey Venom uses a 1200hp variant of this engine. Just out of curiosity, does anybody know the warranties on these two cars?

and Stoppre75, yes I know it's a bumped up version of the LSA found in the Caddy, but that engine was a detuned version of the ZR1's engine. So, short story, detuned vette engine.

Super Snakes have been making some big HP numbers for years with the 5.4.