It's Official: 2011 Ford Mustang GT has 5.0-liter V8

Camaro vs. Mustang vs. Challenger just got more interesting! I'm sure IL will have them fight another round next year!

I wonder how much the new Mustang GT will weigh. And will the new 5.0 really be 5.0L or just 4.9L? Hehehe

Life just got a lot harder for the Camaro.

Sabastian said it.

This thing is going to kill the new Camaro if they can keep the pricing right at the same price (or less!) and offer aggressive gearing.

if they can keep the 2010's over 300-lb advantage on the Camaro and give it a 6-speed, the Mustang will be king. it wont truly be king though until that live rear axle is gone

This should be good - right now the 2010 Mustang is only a 100lbs odd heavier than the E89 Z4 and also does a skidpad of 0.95g compared with the BMW's 0.9g. With this new power and price point, its a helluva deal - and decent handling for a live-axle craft.

Eww. What miserable wheels. But I do like the official word on the power for next year.

Oh boy, that makes the 2011 mustang GT very very desirable.....
camaro are u trembling right now?
U should be.

If the new 2011 4L-V6 mustang has 305hp. Even with the 5.0 moniker plastered on the front finders it will be hard to pass the V6 up without giving it vast amount of deliberation. This will make the V8-V6 debate even harder. It uses to be the insurance rates that were the deciding factor for mustang drivers.

I once owned an 88 5.0 and it was a blast with only 225hp. I certainly won’t be looking down at any 2011-V6 mustang owners.

Doesn't this put both new Mustang engines at 82.4 HP/Liter? Interesting.

82.4hp on the V8 and 76hp per liter on the V6. just about nailed it.

5.0! The most famous numerical designation in my car lifetime! The 5.0 has been my dreaded enemy my entire car driving career. 5.0s taunted my humble Civic LX. Bitch-slapped my Beretta GTZ. Only after acquiring my mighty Carmen Camaro... my 1993 Z28, did I have the power necessary to finally vanquish my respected rival.

Welcome back, 5.0!

impresive seeing how the 87-93 mustangs 5liter only had 45hp per liter they've near

Btrdayz you said it well. Welcome back 5.0

I am really glad Chevy kinda forced Ford to bring this one out. That 4.0L V6 they used was never competitive (I had one) and the 4.6L V8 wasn't getting much respect as a stock engine. Thank you Chevy (and Dodge) for making my childhood favorite remind me (and Ford) what the Mustang is all about. Maybe we can pick up where we left off... just gotta find an excuse my wife will buy to trade in our mighty mighty Toyota Yaris

Ford just needs to paint over all that cheap looking black plastic and then it would just about perfect.

Cant beat a 5.0.

This is awesome. Way to go Ford.

@first class, the 2011 V6 is a 3.7 not the 4.0 that is in there now, if the 4.0 made 305hp it would be 76hp/l as a 3.7 it is 82.4 just as high octane put it. just about nailed it :-)

Awesome accomplishment. IRS or not the new mustangs can still turn well, if not having it keeps the costs down i am all for it.

I was honestly expecting the V8 reveal to claim 427 hp just to one up the camaro as the v6 is 1hp more than the camaros.

Sorry to disappoint the Ford fans but the new Z28 will be coming out in 2011 as well and will use the 556hp supercharged engine from the CTS-V. Ooops.

http://www.chevroletreports.com/blog/1035861_gm-confirms-the-2011-chevrolet-camaro-z28-is-a-go

Why would Ford fans be disappointed with a Z28? The 2011 GT500 gets an alu block which will drop the Stang's weight by 100lbs. So, the GT500 will be 3800lbs and making the same power as what is likely to be a near 4100lb Z28. So, looks like Ford will maintain their 300lb advantage across the board with the dumping of the GT500s boat anchor of an engine block.

+1 to publius...

Ford Mustang v6 (base) vs Camaro v6 (base)
Ford Mustang GT vs Camaro SS
Ford Mustang GT500 vs Camaro Z28

Oh and from rumors from a friend who works for ford claims that the GT500 will be more likely a GT600 with a Twin Turbo 5.0L v8 with roughly 615hp...Z28...Eat your heart out :)

"This thing is going to kill the new Camaro if they can keep the pricing right at the same price (or less!) and offer aggressive gearing."

Lets get back to reality. This will make the Mustang a much better car but the Camaro sells on its mix of performance AND styling. The Mustang will LOOK the same as is does now and is not likely to surpass Camaro sales anytime soon. Most can agree the Mustang is already superior to the Camaro in many ways but that has not helped it on the sales charts. The 2010 looks too much like the last gen model while the Camaro looks fresh and concept car like. The fact that the 2011 Mustang V8 will likely be .2 secs faster to 60 than the Camaro SS is not going to cause a major shift in sales patterns. The Mustang has already won some comparos and the 2011 will continue to win them- but Ford wont win the sales race.

"Lets get back to reality. This will make the Mustang a much better car but the Camaro sells on its mix of performance AND styling."

Ok, let's get back to reality. Camaro has a clear sales lead this year based on the fact that mouth-breathin' mullet-headed Camaro fans have been drooling (even more than usual) over this car since they haven't been able to get a new one since MY02. Let's see what the sales data says in MY12 after the initial surge is over.

And in spite of it's power disadvantage Car and Driver put the '10 GT on the top of the heap. The new V8 should be killer.

On topic: It will be good to see the 5.0 badge back in business, even if it was a bit of fudging back in the day. And at 412 horses, I am looking forward to Camaro/Challenger/Mustang comparos.

Off topic: Please, please, please, Edmunds, I do not come to this site to see posters with screen names such as "nigga." This is offensive to the EXTREME. I don't care what you have to do, but I believe all of us who come her to read and post about cars don't expect to see that sort of tripe. While I fully realize society's mores have changed (after all, there is a show called "Dance Your Ass Off"), I don't believe it has fallen so far that there are no standards at all. It is bad enough to hear this word (in any variation) bandied about so freely in society, but to many people it is still highly offensive. I respectfully request that this post and poster either be taken down or banned. If I see it again, I will not return to the website and I will stop encouraging friends and relatives to view the otherwise highly informative and entertaining website as well.

kingstink ---- The only reason why the mustang has not surpassed the Camaro which historically it usually does, is because most Mustang enthusiasts like myself have been waiting for the '11 to come out. I could have bought a '10 but I knew Ford was building this car so I decided to wait. I have watched the Camaro being developed for over 4 years now and the styling is already looking dated to me and the interior is down right awful. You can't even see out of the thing and the handling with the "independent rear axle" is worse that the "inferior" live axle of the Mustang. Yeah GM. As the saying goes - if it’s not broke don't fix it. Porsche seems to bee doing quite well by this mantra. I'm not a Ford vs. GM guy. I love all cars, I drive an HHR SS(tuned) right now which I love - but you can't beat a big V8.

Sorry Mustang fans, but as has been proven by Shelby and everyone else that throws more power into a new Mustang, it does little or no good and makes the Mustang one of the slowest high horsepower cars in the world!!!!

All you can hope for is Ford does something about the poor aerodynamics and that solid axle rear end. Otherwise, the Mustang will still be the slowest of the bunch!!! Throw in a better automatic transmission and things may actually improve for the Mustang.

One note, I am not a fan one way or the other for any of the muscle cars made today. Just seems Ford has ignores these problems for years. I hope the 2011 corrects these issues.

Hell, I'm just interested in the 300+ hp V6. That's more in line with what I'd like to own.

Now it all comes down to cost. If they can keep the price around the current price of a Mustang GT, this could be one amazing buy.

There's no debate that it's great to see the 5.0L back again, my father had a 5.0L LX when I was growing up and my bother obsessed over that car. I wasn't quite as enthralled as he was, but it had a great sound.

On another note, did Ford ditch the body color mirrors on the 2011? Don't nickel and dime us Ford.

They will make a hybrid 300hp mustang soon. No more V8.

They will make a hybrid 300hp mustang soon.

1487 the sales race has already been won. When the last F car crapped out that was the end of the contest. The pent up demand is just that...pent up. Camaro sales will level out.

thats just enough power to kick that "heavy chevy's" butt this feather weight will also have 6 speed manuals and automatics for this vehicle. how i know this if you remember back a few years ford made a promise that all of there vehicles in the line up will have standard or optional 6 speed trainees by 2014 hence the every new vehicle that cane out since then has had a 6 gear spread and even more astonishing is the first one hooked to a powerful new diesel engine

It's nice to see that the automotive companies are beginning to compete with one another again! While this is exciting to see and the companies continue to seek more fuel efficient vehicles, the Mustang still suffers from one Achilles heel; THE SOLID REAR AXLE!

C'mon Ford everyone loves horsepower, but some of us would prefer to hear and feel 400+ HP that can also carve a canyon road or a weekend switchback at our favorite local road course track. I'll settle for 300+ HP for the chance to spend my money on an optional independent rear suspension and articulating axle.

It's nice to see that the automotive companies are beginning to compete with one another again! While this is exciting to see and the companies continue to seek more fuel efficient vehicles, the Mustang still suffers from one Achilles heel; THE SOLID REAR AXLE!

C'mon Ford everyone loves horsepower, but some of us would prefer to hear and feel 400+ HP that can also carve a canyon road or a weekend switchback at our favorite local road course track. I'll settle for 300+ HP for the chance to spend my money on an optional independent rear suspension and articulating axle.

Can't wait for the Rousch version. That kind of power with a modern drivetrain...mmmmm.

"Ok, let's get back to reality. Camaro has a clear sales lead this year based on the fact that mouth-breathin' mullet-headed Camaro fans have been drooling (even more than usual) over this car since they haven't been able to get a new one since MY02. Let's see what the sales data says in MY12 after the initial surge is over."

Considering the fact that the Camaro was barely selling in 2002 the notion that the new car is selling only to die hard Camaro fanatics is lunacy. Give me a break. Read some of the comments in the owner review section on this site. There are people who owned BMWs driving Camaros now and few actually mention having a Camaro prior to this model. CAmaro haters have been trying to dismiss this car's success since it came out. 8 months after it debuted we still have people claiming the car is about to fade from the scene. When you are outselling a competent key rival by 3-2 margin that is more than an aberation.

I sorta understand the whining about the Stang not having an IRS, but it really depends on how bumpy the road is. On a nicely paved road, like the one's we have in TN, an IRS won't make one bit of difference, unless there is a railroad track bisecting a nasty 90mph sweeper, but I can't say I've seen any. And, especially the "racetrack" comment, there aren't many mid corner imperfections that I've seen on many tracks. It sure didn't seem to hamstring the FR500s when they were kicking ass and taking names on the track.

Lastly, if you are going fast enough to lose control of your car mid turn because it has a live axle, I would hope you were doing it on a track. Because there isn't a road I know of that would cause you do to that at anywhere near the speed limit, and I don't live far from Deal's Gap (The Dragon to you ferriners ;)).

The whole IRS v. live axle seems to be more about bench racing than anything else. Would I like to see Ford develop one? Sure, if they can keep the weight down. Do I think that not having one disqualifies the Stang as a reasonable sports car? Hell no.

bodyblue,

spot on. as a 2006 owner, if it weren't for the fact that i am about to start a family, i'd definitely upgrade to the 2011.

"Ok, let's get back to reality. Camaro has a clear sales lead this year based on the fact that mouth-breathin' mullet-headed Camaro fans have been drooling (even more than usual) over this car since they haven't been able to get a new one since MY02. Let's see what the sales data says in MY12 after the initial surge is over."

You hit all the well worn out anti Camaro talking points. Congrats! The car is still selling though. I know it must be diappointing. When will people understand you dont buy a sporty coupe for visibility? Guess what? you can't see out of a Lambo or Ferrari either and yet people still lust after those cars. The Camaro is not a family sedan and thus folks who are buying a car for cargo carrying, backseat space or stellar visibility aren't likely to buy the car. Is the current car any less practical than the F body model? Doubt it. That car was impractical and cheaply made and unrefined. At least this car is solidly built and sits on a world class chassis. Your explanation of Mustang sales is wishful thinking. The Mustang has not sold as well because a)for the first time in 8 years it has a competitor b) the camaro is attractively priced and competent c)lack of IRS d) the new car looks too much like the old car even though Ford made many changes d) the 2010 engines were carry over. Ford has already lost thousands of customers in 2009 because the 2010 Mustang came with outdated engines while the Camaro came with world beating engines.

BTW, I like the Mustang.

publius,

good post. as a 2006 owner who has taken my mildly modified mustang on a road course i can tell you it is completely unnoticeable.

our roads in indiana aren't that bad, either. the live axle pops its ugly head up every great once in a while, but in daily life it is transparent. especially with a few suspension upgrades.

sure, i'll take a IRS, but keep the price low and the weight down!

Ooops... And here I am toying with 2009- Mustang GTs on my Ralliart... I think it's time I get a bigger turbo haha!

Now that's a Stang GT I would be willing to buy!
and out of the three american entry leven muscle cars, I think the Mustang still looks better :)

"1487 the sales race has already been won. When the last F car crapped out that was the end of the contest. The pent up demand is just that...pent up. Camaro sales will level out. "

can you tell me tonight's lottery numbers too? Unlike you I dont have the gift of seeing the future. Mustang sales might level off too- in case you forgot it was new for 2010 just like the Chevy. Camaro haters have been saying the same thing since April or whenever the Camaro starting outperforming the Mustang in sales. I also love how people are naive enough to think GM isnt going to add features to the Camaro to keep sales brisk. Do you really think the 2011 model wont add colors and features to keep it competitive? In addition, the Camaro has done this with NO incentives- the Mustang has had incentives already this year. When sales begin to sag you can bet Camaro incentives will appear. But you are right, for the 2010 models the sales race has been won- by the Chevy.

1487,

you make a lot of good points about the camaro.

however, i do think the IRS talking point is over-talked. the vast majority of mustang and camaro owners could not care less about IRS vs. live axle.

do you think the camaro would sell less well if it had a live-axle? i don't think most owners care, especially when you consider that the live-axle in the mustang is transparent 90+% of the time. yeah, it would be nice if my mustang could handle mid-corner imperfections like my wife's e90, but it really isn't that bad, especially at legal speeds.

most owners who never take their cars to the quarter-mile track or road course don't care what is underneath as long as it works well.

and as a bmw owner i would never buy the camaro specifically due to the fact that it has poor visibility! one thing i love about my mustang is how the back seats really aren't that bad, the trunk is decent for a weekend road/camping trip, and the visibility is darn good!

and any bmw owner who has moved to the camaro is purely anecdotal, i haven't seen many defections posted on the forums.

I dont think a live axle is lighter than a modern IRS. The Mustang is lighter because its smaller and because its on an older, less rigid chassis. The Mustang is on a cheapened version of the DEw98 platform that supported the 1999 Lincoln LS and the S type. Cars have gotten heavier and more robust since then. The Camaro is heavier because its on a newer platform that is likely far stiffer than the Mustang's.

one other point about the folks dismissing the Camaro- they haven't really advertised the car. If sales slow up I would think some actual TV ads would help Chevy boost them again. I have seen ONE print ad for the Camaro and that was when it first came out. Its been featured briefly in one or two Chevy ads that don't even really talk about the car. The car is selling on the reviews, the styling and the performance. Even if there is pent up demand I wouldnt expect it to wane in 2010.

Sweetness! Just what the new Mustang needed. Now someone has to find Vanilla Ice again, so we can be "rollin' in my Five Point Oh" again.

What a great time to be a musclecar fan. The Mustang, Camaro, and Challenger are all great machines. I would find it very hard to choose amongst them.

S197:

I agree that in the REAL WORLD the IRS issue is minor. However, perception matters in this business and EVERY review of the Mustang noted it lacked an IRS but the Camaro provided one. People want the latest engineering for their dollar even if the real world benefits are minimal. 4 speed automatics work just fine but in 2009 a car with a 4 speed is considered archaic. Its the same with the live axle in the Mustang. At this point only large trucks and compacts (a few)have live axles in the back. The Mustang is probably the only car that can cost $25k-$50k without an IRS. That said, I think styling and powertrain were the biggest factors in Camaro's favor.

Also, I didn't say every BMW owner wanted a Camaro. The fact that you don't want one has no bearing on my point. I said read some of the consumer reviews on edmunds.com and you will see few people indentify themselves as mullet wearing die hard Camaro fans and at least a few mention previously owning BMWs. Dont shoot the messenger. As for visibility, few owners actually listed that as their primary gripe. Most said they got used to it quickly. The issue has been beat to death and yet the car still sells. My guess is buyers experience the visibility problems during the test drive and find them surmountable.

stingray454,

as person who danced to "ice ice baby" at a middle school dance, i would LOVE to see vanilla ice introduce the new 5.0!

rob van winkle rolling and rapping in a 2011 mustang: best... commercial... ever...

"ice is back with my brand new invention!"

ford, do it!!!!! pay him whatever he asks...

1487,

I think your analysis is probably right. The new Camaro has given buyers an option that they didn't have before. This is good for everyone, because now Mustang lovers will get 2 much better engines that they might not have gotten if GM hadn't upped the ante with the Camaro plants.

I would bet the the lack of an IRS is something that only a small percentage of buyers know or care about. I know I've been complaining about is for years. Especially after the 2000 Cobra R offered an IRS and 6-speed. The lack of both in the 2005 redesign seemed short sighted. But reality is that the 2010 Mustang with the Track Pack consistently beats the much more powerful Camaro SS in comparisons.

Where the Camaro really eats the Mustang's lunch has been the entry level V6 car. With Ford stepping up to match the Camaro here, I expect that the Mustang will close the gap and that the two cars will end up posting very similar sales in 2010

so... how is the "perception matters in business" argument not the same for visibility, a much more daily quality of life (and safety) issue?

every review pretty much mentions the visibility issue and yet, as you argue, it is overcome.

so goes with the live-axle issue... i posit.

i say, let's abandon the the visibility and live-axle arguments w/these cars. cause quite honestly, i don't think either is really hurting the sales of either car.

these cars sell on sex-appeal. like when i spun the tires in a parking lot my female friend yelled, "oh my god that is so sexy, i want to rip my clothes off!" she was joking of course, otherwise my rear tires would be bald.

what I find interesting is that most predictions about the camaro have been way off and yet people still wont give GM credit. A few predictions:

1. They debuted it too early, no one will be interested
2. It will have a pushrod V6 standard- base engine wont be competitive
3. It wont outsell the Mustang because the old one never did
4. The timing was all wrong for a new muscle car- young people lust after Civic Si's and "green" cars
5. There is limited demand for the car because all Camaro fans are aging boomers who have moved on
6. Its too large and heavy to be a sports car- doesn't feel like a Miata in the curves- wont sell
7. In an era of greeness no one wants a "gas guzzling" old school muscle car
8. People wont buy a car associated with a movie popular amongst teens- too tacky
9. Hard plastics inside- won't sell
10. limited practicality- won't sell.

Smoking Mustang! If the new 5.0 V8 is making that much horsepower imagine what will do with a Turbo unit or supercharge kit. How about a real GT-500 w/ the 6.2 liter V8 N.A version. Good job Ford.

GM please!!! Is time to drop the pushrods engines. Or are you going to keep boring out the small block to keep your edge? GM is supposed to be the "new GM" Camaro nice car to look from the outside but a mess inside.

Sergio! What are you going to do? Update the Hemi SRT and put the Challenger on a diet!

I have no doubt that the increased HP will help Ford sell more Mustang GTs.

I expect that, on a closed course [ with the typical, fairly smooth asphalt surface ] the new 5.0L Mustang GT will perform even better – despite the lack of an IRS.

And I would be amazed if the area under the TQ curve of that 5.0L, 412 HP V8 equals that of the 6.2L Camaro SS V8.

In the real world [ where I drive ] TQ is important.
Ride quality & stable handling - even over much less than perfect road conditions is very, very important – to me.

We shall see . . .

it's a good start for mustang, but probably not enough to make people buy it over a camaro.

iskh,

Why does GM need to drop pushrods? OHC adds weight and compelexity and offers it's benefits primarily in the upper rev ranges where an engine spends very little time. Pushrod engines like the current GM 6.2l and the old Ford 5.0 make/made great torque down low and across a wide range making them easy to drive and allowed for deep overdrives and low rev's on the highway for better MPG.

I would have been just as happy to see Ford refine the 351 and drop it into the Mustang as to shift over to the 4.6 Modular.

I had a '96 Taurus SHO with 3.4l DOHC, 24V V8 for several years. The engine sounded fantastic screaming to redline, and once it hit about 30 mph the accelleration was great. But off the line, or trybing to squirt into an opening in heavy traffic it sucked. No oomph (it's an industry term).

I think that GM made the right call to enlarge and refine the vernerable pushrod V8 to keep development costs, and thus prices down on the Camaro.

Dear Ford:
The new V6 - 305 hp and the 5.0 V8 - 415 hp is great! Thanks for bringing great engines to the Mustang! But I have to beg you for one more engine option. Please split the difference between the 305 hp and 415hp with a Ecoboost V6 Mustang! Just put the SHO Ecoboost V6 in the Mustang. Don't let the Jay Leno twin turbo V6 Camaro get away from you! Just imagine what the aftermarket can do with Ecoboosted Mustang!

"so... how is the "perception matters in business" argument not the same for visibility, a much more daily quality of life (and safety) issue?"

It doesnt matter because people care more about the style of the car than visibility. the sales verify that. I don't know why you are insisting otherwise. If the visibility was a deal breaker the car would not be selling. It outsold the Mustang almost 2-1 last month. Do you think Astons and Ferraris and R8's have great visibility? Low slung cars never have great visibility. They trade sytle for sightlines. Visibility is down across the board these days with cars like the CC, Lacrosse, CLS, etc. on the market.

Comparing the live axle to the visibility issue is ridiculous. Why? People have been complaining about the Mustang live axle for year- it has nothing to do with the presence of the Camaro. Even without the Camaro many felt the live axle was a detriment to the car. In addition, the Camaro has sold very well relative to the Mustang which suggests the compromises Chevy made to deliver show car styling have been less risky than Ford's decision to preserve the live axle and give the 2010 Mustang such a tepid restyling.

"GM please!!! Is time to drop the pushrods engines. Or are you going to keep boring out the small block to keep your edge? GM is supposed to be the "new GM" Camaro nice car to look from the outside but a mess inside."

GM is done with DOHC V8s. Once the DTS, STS and Lucerne disappear next year GM wont even have a DOHC V8. They cant justify the development costs when the small block is so effective and cheap to make. The LS3 is superior to the Northstar V8 in every way. The LS3 also stacks up well vs this new 5L V8 from Ford. More power and more torque. I would guess the 5L will have a slightly higher redline. The LS3 redlines at 6600rpm while Toyota's 2.4L or 2.7L I4 redlines at 6200.

"GM is done with DOHC V8s. Once the DTS, STS and Lucerne disappear next year GM wont even have a DOHC V8."

If the Caddy STS-v had been built with an LS2 or LS3
And continued on with the LSA in the current CTS-v,
I would almost certainly have bought one.
The North* V8 with s/c is nice.
But and LSx is better in 9 out of 10
real world driving circumstances -
IMHO -
and cheaper, too.

"GM is done with DOHC V8s. Once the DTS, STS and Lucerne disappear next year GM wont even have a DOHC V8. They cant justify the development costs when the small block is so effective and cheap to make. The LS3 is superior to the Northstar V8 in every way. The LS3 also stacks up well vs this new 5L V8 from Ford. More power and more torque. I would guess the 5L will have a slightly higher redline. The LS3 redlines at 6600rpm while Toyota's 2.4L or 2.7L I4 redlines at 6200."

Amen. Thank you 1487. Import-snobs can sneer all they want at the old push-rod technology, but it hasn't proven to be inferior to OHC yet.

Comparing sales for a massively hyped product and comparing them to sales on a vehicle that has been around in similar for for many years is silly. Give the sales curve a change to level out to something realistic and them you can argue all you want about numbers. Doing so now does not make any sense. This is common sense for sales on almost any product, vehicles or not. It remains to be seen whether the Camaro or Mustang will be sales king.

A lot of people mention the fact that Camaro sales were pent up for years while the GM faithful were waiting for its return. There is probably a little truth to that but I also think there are a lot of buyers who just see it as the newest kid on the block. Maybe their dad had a Camaro. People also are saying that Ford never would have developed this engine if it were not for the Camaro and Challenger. Maybe. But I think one also has to admit that there probably never would have been a return for either the GM or Chrysler PONY cars if Ford had not kept the faith with the Mustang and continued its development even when there was no competition. Was there a Camaro or Challenger in 2005? Hell no. But there was a major redesign of the Mustang for 2005. What prompted that? If anything, the only reason the other two were brought back was because Ford proved that there was still a good market for these cars if you offered a decent package.
As for Ford not offering this engine until after the Camaro came out, do you realize that this engine is also going into the F150 and that the entire modular family including the 4.6L, 5.4L and 6.8L V10 will be replaced by the Coyote 5.0 and the Boss 6.2 across the board? These new V8s from Ford have been in development for years because they knew they needed lighter, more efficient engines to meet ever more stringent fuel mileage standards. I think it's pretty darn impressive that Ford's puny little 5.0 develops nearly the same output as the GM and Chrysler V8s but with over a full liter less displacement and no forced induction. Just good, solid engineering.
And speaking of pent up sales, there are an awful lot of Mustang faithful out there that knew what was coming for 2011...

1487.

Are you serious about it not having ads? It's had 4 hours of movie commercials. And been featured in nearly every ad for those movies. It's been on TV. It's been tlaked about as a prize for contests. It's been talked about all over. As for it outselling the mustang. This 5.0 has been the worst kept secret ever. Almost every Mustang forum has had rumors of 400hp since before the 2010 came out. Are you going to buy a 2010 when you know there is at least a 75% chance of the 2011 getting 100 more hp? I don't care what car you are looking at. If next years Camaro was getting 100hp more. You'd more than likely be waiting. You are right on some of your points however.
Since they started competing. The Camaro has outsold the Mustang in 7 years. Though 7 out of 30 something does not make it a strong argument for an awesome seller.
Debuted too early? Well yes they did. I know of at least a few people who bought mustangs because they no longer wanted to wait for Chevy. Not lots, but a few sales lost, and that's just the people I know of.
Young people lust after Honda's? Well yes but mostly because that is all they can afford. Both the Camaro and the Mustang are nice cars. But approaching even $20k puts it out of many high school afterschool jobs.
Camaro fans are old? Well maybe they are, maybe they are not. But with the retro mustang many old mustang owners relived their early days with a new mustang. So the GM finally realised retro can sell a camaro.
Too large and heavy to be a sports car? It is. But it's not a sports car. It's a pony car. Corvette is GM's sports car.

Where's the classic "5.0" fender badging?

This is somewhat old news but it does address the fender badge question:

http://www.mustangblog.com/blog/1021574_5-0-fender-badge-returns-for-the-2011-ford-mustang-gt

"Import-snobs can sneer all they want at the old push-rod technology, but it hasn't proven to be inferior to OHC yet."

That depends on the size of motor. In large engines like V8s, high RPM operation is not necessary to create big power. The simpler, more affordable pushrod engines can really shine in a car working people actually buy.

However in smaller engines, pushrods are completely outclassed. Can you name any good pushrod 4 cylinder engines?

For the people complaining about the non body color mirrors or or it not having a 5.0 badge or anything else about the picture if you even bothered to read all 3 sentences of the article it says that the picture is of a 2010 mustang, not the 2011 that the article is about.

Something not being said in the Camaro sales success story is the dominance of the V8 car in those sales. V6 sales have been soft to date in comparison.

In any event strong sales in the first year are no real indication of its success, the Challenger also out sold the Mustang for a bit IIRC. As soon as the F5's design gets some water under the bridge thats when it will be time to judge the Camaro's staying power based on what it offers compared to the Mustang.

After the new wears off, if the stiffer chassis, bigger engine, and IRS are the real reasons for its success then it will continue to dominate sales.

I am not trying to bash the Camaro but lets look at some outside (government) issues with the car as in future CAFE standards. We all now that cars will need to get better fuel economy in the future. So this creates two very serious problems for the Camaro. One its weight at close to 4000lbs (the Z28 will weight even more) hinders fuel economy. The Challenger will also have the same problem. Reducing weight on the car will mean exotic materials (i.e. lots of money). The 2nd reason is its engine, whose roots date back to the 1950's push rod V8. (and people complain about the Mustang's solid axle) GM will have to go smaller and DI (direct injection) to keep up with the future fuel economy standards. This means they will have to spin the motor higher to get more power out of it, which will reduce torque, big problem for a near 4000 lbs car. I have heard rumors about a 5.5L V8 in the works for the Corvette so we'll see.

Ford has tried to solve this issue by keeping the weight off the Mustang and staying will a smaller V8 with variable valve timing. They also haven't gone to DI yet so there is still power and better fuel efficiency to be had with this motor. Can you imagine this car with a 12.5:1 compression DI motor! - Oh, for those who are not familiar with DI you can run a higher compression ratio on pump gas with no problem. My car puts out 23lbs of boost on 10:1 compression on pump gas with no problems even in the Texas heat.

Its funny - demand or the lack there of won't kill off these cars......the Government will. I myself plan on buying some type of V8 pony car very soon because who knows how much longer we have to have the opportunity to.

1487,

you are trying to have it both ways. you'll never admit it, but i think everyone else sees it.

you complain about the live-axle of the mustang and say that perception matter in business. yet which of the pony cars' production has never been interrupted?

yet the well-known perception that the camaro is a bloated, poor-handling (relatively), beast that you can't see out of, well, that's ok because it doesn't affect sales. (never mind it has only been for sales less then a year.)

and as to your argument that the live-axle issue is a long-suffering issue, well, like i said, the mustang has never ceased production so there is a lot of history. if the camaro continued to be a fat, poor-hadling pic with poor visibility for the next 30 years, people will be continually complaining about that i assure you.

but we agree that the live-axle and everything bad about the camaro doesn't matter, because, again, these cars sell solely on their looks, power, and recognition.

06vbgt,

you make an excellent point. i have considered upgrading to a new mustang. however, i would never have bought an 09 or 2010 due to the fact that 5.0 coming back was well known.

i see a LOT of 4.6 guys upgrading.

Finaly Ford is bringing back the 302, a 5.0 in a much nicer package since the early 70's at that.
This engine first appeared in 1968 for the Mustang, replacing the 289 another excellent engine and both had been Ford's most reliable V8's in its cars that didn't suck back the gas. They then decided to go high tech in the late 90's and build a smaller V8 that had more wireing than a patient on life support. I think the auto manufactures are finaly listening, all they need to do now is wind back the prices of thier cars 30 years so that every body can afford one with out paying a mortgage payment for the house and another one for the car parked in the drive way..
I love the new Stangs,,,I want one...

Ummm.....the old pushrod 302 is not coming back. The new 5.0 is a Romeo.

5.0 is Great News! Brute power, however, wont cut it anymore. The Mustang is simply too sloppy for its own good. Steering is too light, and handling is too soft. Even with the track pack. Even with fordracingparts FR3 package. My 2010 Mustang GT with FR3 suspenssion package is unsuitable for pleasurable mountain side road carving. With even more hp and torque, I suspect the current settup would be down right dangerous. I hope Ford realizes America's growing taste for European style driving dynamics. I sure wish Ford engineers would buy a BMW and learn! A harsh taste of reality but true. Look at 3 series sales, look at the 370Z, G37, Mazda3speed, Civic Si.. all of which have IRS, and focus on dynamics and the experience from the helm (steering wheel).

A few things going for the Mustang GT are its relatively cheap price, relatively low weight (it's still a pig though), glorious engine note, ever present torque down low and high, and I think its styling looks respectable albiet a touch immature. The Mustang GT is a helluva bang for the buck, true.

The Mustang has nudged significantly in the right direction for 2010. It's one of a few American cars worthy of pride. I hope Ford continues, and I'm root'n for'em.

PS. I sure wish Ford would offer lease programs for it's Mustang GTs.

Joseph
San Diego

Thank you Edmunds! Your response to my request is duly noted!

Folks, wake up. Keep up with "your brand sux, mine rulez (in the 8th grade fantasy contest)" and you'll have no fun, affordable cars at all, insteald you'll get more speed cameras, microphones listening for wheelspin and maybe a "fun" radar to be sure you don't enjoy driving. Instead, start dope-smacking your congressbot to stop legislating and harrassing these cars out of existence. The ninny crowd is pushing for it, you need to push back.

You won't have have affordable affordable pony or muscle cars - and today's are far better in real driving than the classics - for long unless a special category is carved out for them as was done for Mercedes, Bentley etc. They're an essential part of what's good about the USA.

Whether it's the new 5.0 Mustang, Camaro SS, even the heavy but great looking Challenger you can't lose. You'll need new pistons to run boost w a 5.7 Hemi, the stock piston is practically a racing part, fully stressed from the factory, but the design does allow great breathing + there's room under the hood for a twin-screw. The ninny crowd wants no fun for anyone without AMG money and every year they gain another inch. Affordable V8s from GM, Ford or Chrysler - get one while you can.

"Are you serious about it not having ads? It's had 4 hours of movie commercials. And been featured in nearly every ad for those movies. It's been on TV. It's been tlaked about as a prize for contests. It's been talked about all over. As for it outselling the mustang. This 5.0 has been the worst kept secret ever. Almost every Mustang forum has had rumors of 400hp since before the 2010 came out. Are you going to buy a 2010 when you know there is at least a 75% chance of the 2011 getting 100 more hp? I don't care what car you are looking at. If next years Camaro was getting 100hp more. You'd more than likely be waiting."

1. The Camaro has barely been advertised BY CHEVROLET. I never said the car wasn't in a movie- we all know that. My point was that its success is impressive considering lack of incentives and lack of ads.

2. Historically most Mustang sales are V6s so I'm not sure I buy this theory that people were holding out for the 2011 model. Mustang sales have been trailing off throughout 2009 and considering many buy the car for style and not performance I'm not sure that the 5L v8 is the reason for that. In addition, the current V8 is only about .4 secs slower than the Camaro to 60- its not slow at all.

3. Its extremely rare for a car to experience a big sales boost in its second year after a redresign. I would expect Camaro and Mustang sales to show little growth in 2010 because so many bought them in 2009 when they were new. The new engines will definitely keep the Mustang in the game, but I would not expect the sales positions to reverse based on more hp. BTW, the Genesis coupe hasnt come close to Camaro or Mustang sales in spite of the fact that its affordable and came out the box with a great V6 engine.

"However in smaller engines, pushrods are completely outclassed. Can you name any good pushrod 4 cylinder engines?"

No one makes them. GM stopped making an OHV four cylinder back in 2002 or 2003.

"you complain about the live-axle of the mustang and say that perception matter in business. yet which of the pony cars' production has never been interrupted?"

I have no idea what you are talking about. Let me try and simplify this for you: the Mustang's live axle was NOT an issue when it had ZERO competition. From 2002 until 2009 the car was all alone in this segment and thus people had no choice but to accpet the live axle. The Camaro isnt practical but it NEVER has been. Thats the part people like you keep ignoring. Was the F-body a practical car? Hell no. Cramped backseat, cramped passenger seat, low seating position, limited cargo space, huge dimensions with a tiny interior- it was a mess. The new Camaro is still impractical but the chassis and refinement are world class. Huge difference. People complaining about the lack of visibility and practicality seem to be out of touch with what this car represents. The 2010 Camaro delivered better hardware than the 2010 Mustang- period. That and superior looks are what propelled the car to the top of the sales charts. If my reasoning makes no sense than YOU explain why its sold so well in spite of all the skeptics who said it was the wrong car and the wrong time.

Man, I feel sorry for all the people who just purchased one of the 2010 Mustangs. They thought they were getting the latest and greatest from Ford and now they are complete rubbish after only being out for a year…

Ford should offer some kind of a buy back option for people who want to trade their 2010's in for a 2011 because I would honestly be pretty pissed off about that.

Man, you Ford fan boys really are jaded. If history has shown us anything thing it's that Ford's numbers are always (Since early/mid 1990s) grossly overrated. Their GT500 runs a 12.8 with 500HP; what do you think a car with 100 less horsepower is going to do? It's a marketing scheme.

Live axle this, pushrod that, blah,blah,blah. Nonsense.
Here's a fact: Mustang people buy mustangs and camaro people buy camaros. I don't know who buys challengers. All three are good cars and the competition will make them all better which is good for everybody. Everyone will argue their car is better because it has a better widget or gets better gas mileage at 10,000 feet of elevation, or the interior smells like chocolate when it sits in the sun. Who cares! All cars are a heck of a lot better than they used to be, thank goodness! 99% of the people don't drive any car near it's potential so performance numbers are really a moot point. Don't get me wrong, I like a fast car that handles well and I'm really glad carmakers up the ante every couple of years. I just don't buy a car because it is 2/10ths of a nano second quicker than another make. I buy what I like.
The questions a potential buyer should ponder: Does the car make me happy? Do I find it attractive? Is it fun to drive? Is it safe and dependable? Would I be embarrassed to drive it to my 20th high school reunion? Would I buy a car that Vanilla Ice endorses? ( I hope he stays in whatever hole he's been hiding in).
Buy what makes you happy so you don't have to try and justify it to strangers on the internet. I bought a 2010 Grabber Blue V6 mustang for my daughter. She thinks it's the coolest thing ever. Her friends love it and people from all walks of life ask her about it all the time. Based on that, Ford hit this one out of the park. I'm sure camaro and challenger owners can say the same thing. I say hurrah for pony cars.

I would like to add the following list of new automobiles I like:

Mustang GT and GT500
Camaros SS
Challenger
Corvette
F150
G8
Solstice
Miata
BMW 3 series
Porsche Cayman
Anything by Audi except Q7
Jaguar XKR and XFR
Bentley Continental Silver Spur

I would proudly drive any of these ( and I own more than a couple of them)

Yawn! Everyone knows that REAL performance these days is coming out of Japan. Less HP per liter than my Civic Si, does not sound Hi Tech like my VTEC Civic Si, does not corner like my Civic Si, cannot drive in the snow like my Civic Si. These cars are for fat, hair metal, over the hill types. Detroit is out of touch with the car culture of my generation. Dear Santa...please bring me more toyz for my Civic Si!!

Great! A new motor and the same rear suspension the Donner Party used to cross the Rockies. Way to go, Ford.

Real horse power comes from Japan? That's laughable.

When was the last time you saw a honda powered funny car run under 5-second 1/4 mile at over 300mph? That's right, never.

1487: Of course you don't want to buy into the theory. You think the camaro is better. And that is fine. But reality is the mustang still has traditionally outsold it. Whether it be V6 or V8 it is stilling selling enough numbers to be in production 45+ years later. Not so for the Camaro. If you think people that would have bought a V8 mustang are not waiting for 2011. You are not in touch with reality.

Way2goslick: Thanks for the typical ricer argument. HP per liter (ROFLMAO) are you kidding me? I don't care if you honda gets 100hp per liter. It's still underpowered for taking on things like a mustang or camaro or challenger. If muscle/Pony cars are for over the hill, fat, hair metal types. I would say that in following the tradition of steroetype. Imports are for people who cannot figure out that BIG wings on the wrong axle don't make for traction, I wear my baseball cap backwards or sideways because I don't know which way I am going, my pants are baggy and hanging down to my knees because I forgot how to measure my waist with a tapemeasure types.

Anybody who wants a more complicated engine is insane. I now own a complicated N54 engine in a BMW and have a new found respect for simple tech that doesn't require the WHOPPER to fix it. Yes it's cool to have all this computer technology, but to me I now see the beauty of a big engine with simple design. I've got twin turbo, direct injection, VANOS and lots of things that will all be way too expensive to fix.

I look at super cars and see that Ferrari's have major service at 3,000 miles and then think...hey the Corvette may not look the best, but at least the engine can last.

I'd still say they should have started coming out with Super Charged V6s...more power and better MPG.

1487: Of course you don't want to buy into the theory. You think the camaro is better. And that is fine. But reality is the mustang still has traditionally outsold it. Whether it be V6 or V8 it is stilling selling enough numbers to be in production 45+ years later. Not so for the Camaro. If you think people that would have bought a V8 mustang are not waiting for 2011. You are not in touch with reality.

Way2goslick: Thanks for the typical ricer argument. HP per liter (ROFLMAO) are you kidding me? I don't care if you honda gets 100hp per liter. It's still underpowered for taking on things like a mustang or camaro or challenger. If muscle/Pony cars are for over the hill, fat, hair metal types. I would say that in following the tradition of steroetype. Imports are for people who cannot figure out that BIG wings on the wrong axle don't make for traction, I wear my baseball cap backwards or sideways because I don't know which way I am going, my pants are baggy and hanging down to my knees because I forgot how to measure my waist with a tapemeasure types.

Once upon a time in the mid '80s it was a Big Deal to have the 5.0 pushing out 205 HP!

412 HP out of a car that will likely do 25+ MPG on the highway? Bring it on!

Way2goslick - you are out of touch. HP/L means nothing. Your pathetic Civic SI is just about the slowest sport compact out there and doesn't handle better than a Mustang. On a road track the Mustang will destroy it. Ricers think that Mustangs don't handle well but they do (at least the new ones do). You may make 100 hp/l but your car is still slower than most V6 family cars on the market today. Yes, your Civic may not have the "high tech" sound (while subjective, most people agree a Civic with a fart pipe sounds horrible) the Mustang sounds much better... very few cars sound as good as a 4.6 or 5.0 Ford engine.

If you wanted a fast sport compact the SI was a terrible choice. The GTI is faster, handles as well if not better, gets as good if not better mpg, and is more practical. The MS3 is a better performance car for the money. If you wanted something good in the snow then a WRX will spank you silly little Civic in every performance category. The SI is a underpowered joke.