Random Mustang trivia of the day - the word "Mustang" does not show up anywhere on the outside of the car, and the sill plate(s) is the only place on our longterm 2011 Ford Mustang GT where I could find it on static display.
Anyway, reader mail time. Comment "christople" asks:
So after 20k miles, between this and the 370z you guys had new which of the two would you want in your garage?
Hmm. In my garage? Hit the jump.
The surprise here is that, despite their morphological differences, these cars are more alike than you might expect. In particular, the 370Z drives chunkier than it ought to, and the Mustang offers real-deal performance. Both are very fast. They may be apples and oranges, but its a citrusy apple and a crunchy tangerine.
I prefer the Nissan's size. And its more buttoned-down chassis. I'm not crazy about its clunky gearchange and the fact that the VQ engine makes me wince when I wind it out -- too coarse. Really, though, the part I least like about the Z is that it its pure sports car promise is undermined by mass and packaging. It feels dense and claustrophobic. Thick. Nuance and reward which should be present in spades is curiously absent.
The Mustang could hardly be described as nuanced, but it's a bit more honest. And its V8 hits all the right notes, both auditory and propuslive. But the Mustang drives like I'm playing frisbee in pants that are a few sizes too big. There's plenty of freedom to go like hell, but there's this extra slack to contend with. To me this stems from the need for its chassis engineers to accommodate the dynamic implications of the live axle. Given how far Ford has evolved this layout, I'd be curious to see what they could do when free of its constraints.
So, in short, neither is my cuppa, but the Z comes closer. However, a 500Z -- a Z with the Mustang's 5.0-liter V8 stuffed inside -- would address some of my whinging about the Z's powertrain, if not the nuance thing.
Jason Kavanagh, Engineering Editor
christople says:
01:52 PM, 02/ 7/12
Thanks Jkay!
Don't forget to have all the rest of the writers chime in on their favorite used sports car!!
Z06/M3/Miata/911/NSX
ed124c says:
02:06 PM, 02/ 7/12
So that means the V6 has this baggy pants thing also? Disappointing if true.
carguy622 says:
02:22 PM, 02/ 7/12
As smitten as I am with the Z, I would take the Mustang in a heartbeat if I could only have one. It has a decent trunk and an "emergency" backseat.
subytrojan says:
03:01 PM, 02/ 7/12
It wouldn't hurt to insert a shameless plug for the comparo Jay wrote here.
http://www.insideline.com/nissan/370z/2009/comparison-test-2010-ford-mustang-gt-vs-2009-nissan-370z.html
subytrojan says:
03:02 PM, 02/ 7/12
Although the 'stang in that comparo didn't have the Coyote V8...
slickersdrip says:
03:10 PM, 02/ 7/12
I could abide a 560Z. I have the feeling it would cannibalize the GT-R like no tomorrow, though. Maybe an Infiniti G56 to keep them separate?
church123 says:
03:58 PM, 02/ 7/12
I feel the same way as JKav. I have no problem recommending the 5.0 to friends and acquaintences looking for serious go for minimal $$$. And in terms of objective handling numbers the Z really doesn't have much on the Stang at all (in fact, I'll bet the Stang is better in some ways). But as good as the Mustang has become, I'm just not a huge fan of how it drives.
The Z though, is also disappointing. Don't get me wrong, the interior on the 370 is soooo much better than the 350. And I have grown fond of the VQ37VHR engine after owning one (G37) for 18 months now. But while the VQ is powerful for what it is, it just doesn't rip through the gears like a 7500 rpm V6 ought to. I'm not too concerned with the sound (maybe because my G37 is much quieter inside to begin with), but the drivetrain feels heavy, like it has too much flywheel mass. Tuning helps a little with this, but the Mustang benefits even more from tuning, so that's a non-starter if you're a Z booster. And while I like the Z chassis and handling better than the Stang, the brake problems that have been exhibited are really disappointing. Sure, you can upgrade, but that (1) shouldn't be necessary and (2) the failure mode is unacceptable.
Count me in for a 560Z, 500Z (FX50 engine), G56, whatever. I'd gladly pay $10k over the price of a decently equipped Mustang for that. Until then though, I think the Z sales continues to wither in the face of the on paper and visceral acceleration advantage of the Mustang. Horsepower sells in this class.
kindofblue says:
04:34 PM, 02/ 7/12
I'd love to see a headlight post on the Mustang in the same vein as the Camry post. I searched and I don't think one has been made.
And I would definitely take the Mustang.
allthingshonda says:
05:45 PM, 02/ 7/12
Agree kindofblue there should be a headlight post for the Mustang and all of the long term cars. Also shows how far American carmakers have come when you wish the Japanese car had a Ford powertrain. Got to wonder though how long the 5.0 engine will be around. I read that a Ford engineer stated that an Ecoboost Mustang has been built and tested and it actually out performs the 5.0. He stated that Ford developed and built the 5.0 V8 because the market demands a V8 in it's pony cars and Turbocharged V6 (even if it performs better) would never sell when V8 Chevys and Dodges are available. Ford took a big risk with the Ecoboost F-150 and it sells equal to the V8. I think the 5.0's days are numbered in the Mustang. So will V8's in the Camaro since GM is also developing a turbo version of the 3.6 engine. Everyone remembers the old turbo V6 Buick Regal Grand Nationals that ate Mustangs and Z28's (and Vettes) for lunch all day everyday.
hybris says:
06:09 PM, 02/ 7/12
@allthingshonda
In the car makers know that having a V8 is an essential part of the Pony/Muscle car formula and if a Turbo V6 beats out the current NA V8 then that just means that the next gen Mustang will have a upgraded and updated 4v 6.2L V8 or maybe they will bring back the 460 (7.5L) big block V8 and give it the modern tech update.
In the end they always know that they will gain more sales if they keep the V8 and will gain more if it can out do the turbo V6 and they know that if they need to drop in a even bigger NA V8 to do it then they will gain massive boosts in sales comparatively.
bodayguy says:
06:53 PM, 02/ 7/12
I faced this exact scenario 16 months ago. I was coming from a series of 350Zs and wanted another Z. But the Mustang engine is intoxicating. Nissan needs to get 400 HP in the Z and they need to get the price in the pony car territory. I chose the Mustang. (and it's cheaper to mod, I found out).
bassrockerx says:
07:34 PM, 02/ 7/12
looks like the next gen hyundai genisis will have it figured out im just hoping the R spec with the 350hp v6 will be less expensive then the mustang.
i think the real winner is the v6 mustang it offers a track package for cheap and you no longer are driving a "whimpy" mustang
if the z offered a turbo 4 engine with 200-250hp i would be all for it, it would be amazing to get such a bargain true sports car.... or maybe i can wait for the next gen miata to come out .. hopefully it will have a coupe version because i can't own a convertable
sailorbeavis says:
08:29 PM, 02/ 7/12
I like them both, but would side with the Mustang.
However, I think this debate is a bit odd. The Z-car is a 2-seater high-performance coupe / convertible, and it attempts to compete with the Corvette. In that respect, it offers fantastic value for money, albeit at reduced performance. It was Nissan's "halo car" but that mantle has been taken up by the GT-R.
The only reason that it's compared to the Mustang is because it's about the same size and has the same power-to-weight ratio. Compared to the Mustang, the 370Z has no chance. You can get a Mustang GT (or Camaro, or Challenger, or Genesis Coupe) well-equipped for the price of a base Z.
If Nissan made a 370Z 2+2, then the comparison would be more apt, I think, but since they don't, give me the Mustang. Like it or not, you can't strap a kid to the roof.
bodayguy says:
09:46 PM, 02/ 7/12
I don't think too many people use the back seat in a Mustang. It's a fair comparison if the buyer is realistic about themselves.
carchatter1 says:
08:56 AM, 02/ 8/12
@bodayguy: "I don't think too many people use the back seat in a Mustang. It's a fair comparison if the buyer is realistic about themselves."
I have 2 small kids and they would fit perfect in the back seat of a Stang. It's the perfect car for an enthusiast who needs it occasionally for taking the kids. That's being realistic. If I bought a Z that would be completely un-realistic for me. So I guess it depends on your reality. I take it you have no kids.
carchatter1 says:
09:06 AM, 02/ 8/12
@bodayguy:
I now see from your earlier post that you bought a Mustang, maybe you do occasionally need the rear seats? I hope you are enjoying it. I would buy it just for the fact that it seems like a more "fun" vehicle than the Z, not even considering the practicality.
saunupe1911 says:
11:16 AM, 02/ 8/12
Allow me to share my perspective. I originally bought a 06 G35 sedan, which is basically a 4 door Z with softer springs. I absolutely loved the car because it was one of the fastest sedans on the road a few years back. I couldn't justify the price of 4.6L Mustang with only 326 HP. I also didn't care for any of the other muscle cars, but I really wanted a V8. I just needed a little more power during my daily commute. Then the 5.0 debuted. WOW! I was blown away. My dream car has always been the M3. Then Ford admitted that the M3 was their benchmark for the 5.0. Then Motor Trend did a comparison and said that the 5.0 would be a better car only if it had better dampening. I was sold! I traded my G for the 5.0. It's an absolute blast to drive, cheap to mod/repair, has a great well equipped price, and is so powerful. My 5.0 produced 374 RWHP (around 435-440 HP to the crank) on the dyno bone stock. That's insane! Plus it has a usable backseat for kids. That's all I need until my little one turns 10......10 yrs from now lol. The 370Z is a good car but not great. It's overdue for some turbo charging or the 5.6L V8 and a more responsive suspension. The 5.0 is a great car! It has its flaws, but its positives overshadow its negatives. Plus you can mod the 5.0 to achieve an even greater level of performance and tune it to your individual liking.
csubowtie says:
01:04 PM, 02/ 8/12
I would pick the Mustang based on sound alone. The Nissan engine is one of the worst sounding things on the road. The Mustang on the other hand sounds glorious. I took a ride in a 370Z and didn't like how tall the dash was either. Made me *feel* like I could barely see out the windshield, and I'm 6'2".
bodayguy says:
01:32 PM, 02/ 8/12
You're right, I don't have kids. But if I did, I can't imagine thinking the Mustang back seat was a fair idea. My brother has a used M5, and that's how I'd lean - a nice sport sedan. I guess maybe a Mustang would be OK if your other car was a minivan or something.
thenewblack says:
04:35 PM, 02/ 8/12
"if the z offered a turbo 4 engine with 200-250hp i would be all for it"
/\
This.
Make it a little lighter with a ~240hp and price it at $25k.