It’s time for an accounting update of the money we’ve spent so far on the 1985 Porsche 911 Carrera M491.
How you feel about it probably depends on your thinking about used cars versus real estate.
When you buy a used car, you’re generally hoping to duck the initial cost of depreciation, squeeze as much useful life out of the machinery before the inevitable maintenance costs begin to mount up, then dump it and move on to something else. It’s a kind of slash-and-burn strategy from the pioneer days, where you’d clear the forest, raise a bunch of corn until the land became exhausted, then move on to somewhere else.
When you’re looking at a really old car, the real estate idea applies. When you’re buying a used house, you look for the most undervalued property in a good neighborhood, improve it with sweat equity and strategic upgrades, then sell out at a profit and begin again in an even better neighborhood. Those of us who have grown up in California, which has been a kind of ongoing land swindle since 1888, are used to this way of thinking.
So around here we tend to think of genuinely old cars as real estate. There is usually a bunch of deferred maintenance to address and the costs can be discouraging. But the value of collectible-style cars on the auction circuit is alluring (if not always a realistic goal), and the market for a semi-collectible car is always stronger than that for a tired old used car.
In any case, our initial cost amounted to $16,000. As of June 16, 2011, we had spent $2,546 for assorted repairs and improvements as described in this post.
Since that time, we have spent $399.44 for:
1) Rearview mirror repair, $4
2) Wheel cap repair, $5
3) Turtle Wax Black Box self-detail, $21.99 (not including $25 for Montecristo #4 - Habano)
4) H5 headlight bulb replacement, $54.36
5) Bushing replacement for clutch pedal, $314
The value of a 1985 Porsche 911 Turbo Look ranges between a low of $21,800 and a high of $29,000 (down $2,200 overall since 2008), according to Porsche guru Bruce Anderson in Excellence. The 2011 pricing guide of Keith Martin’s Sports Car Market reports that recent sales indicate the M491’s price ranges between a low of $21,000 and a high of $23,000.
Meanwhile, we only have seen two M491s advertised for sale in PCA’s Porsche Panorama (which attracts only cars that have been well cared for by PCA members) over the course of the summer, one priced at $36,900 and another at $32,600. We've also seen a nice white one on the Pelican Parts forum for $22,500. And every time we venture into public with the Black Plague, someone pulls out a fistful of cash and offers us money for it.
Did we do the right thing? You make the call. (Remember, our car has a fresh engine and fresh transmission.)
Michael Jordan, Executive Editor, Edmunds.com
bmw__m5 says:
12:00 PM, 09/ 6/11
Yes, but I would've done without alot of your previous repairs.
jeepsrt says:
12:08 PM, 09/ 6/11
How does the salvage title affect those resale values?
throwback says:
12:15 PM, 09/ 6/11
I think you did the right thing. These cars are very rare (turbo look)I have no doubt you will sell the car for at least what you initially payed for it. As a weekend car this is a great value, especially if you can do some of the work yourself. That is part of the charm of a old car. For less than the price of a loaded Honda Fit, you have a fun to drive and unique car. If you're a car guy on a limited budget, it doesn't get much better than that.
texases says:
12:21 PM, 09/ 6/11
I imagine you'll come out even, but the salvage title will be a major barrier to making any money on it. For regular cars that would translate into a 50% cut off the price, here, who knows?
banhugh says:
12:40 PM, 09/ 6/11
Thank you for the update.
jasond52 says:
01:13 PM, 09/ 6/11
That salvage title is the elephant in the room.
I'm pricing 993's right now and I've found a couple of very nice ones REALLY cheap. Like, this must be a typo cheap. Then I read closely and see "Salvage Title". Watch out!
leftnose says:
01:51 PM, 09/ 6/11
Didn't you buy a new steering wheel as well?
bankerdanny says:
02:19 PM, 09/ 6/11
I think that the car is probably worth about what you paid for it, perhaps a little more.
As others have mentioned, the salvage title has a major impact on value. The lack of AC on a black car in Souhern California will hurt you too.
bassrockerx says:
02:28 PM, 09/ 6/11
I guess for 1985 numbers matching does not matter all that much but if your going to try to sell it for a profit I would consider you guys crooks if you did not get the AC fully functioning. and it would be nice if you at least do some suspension work like tie rod ends, body bushings and stuff like that maybe even get some fresh shocks and strut but maybe you have already done that is have to go back and see what all that 2500 has already included
joefrompa says:
02:52 PM, 09/ 6/11
The thing is: these guys are likely to buy this Porsche, drive it for a year and 10,000 miles, sink $3000-4000 into it, and then sell it for $4k more than they bought it for.
In other words - free Porsche for a year (minus occasional headaches).
That's the definition of winning in my book.
Old Porsches are hugely about the look. With you straightening out a few of its issues, and with the prices you've quoted, I see no problem with you looking at $20k for the car down the line.
I do wonder what you've been offered.
joefrompa says:
02:54 PM, 09/ 6/11
Salvage titles definitely knock some value by the way, but it depends on why it was salvaged and what a careful inspection reveals. Was the car stuffed? Or was it simply banged up? Was it flooded? Did it catch on fire? Was is auctioned off or did the original owner retain it? etc.
A salvage title itself may knock 20% off the car's value - the inspection, or story behind it, is what dictates if that stays at 20% or jumps to 50% off.
blueprint1 says:
05:44 PM, 09/ 6/11
Car guys down South have it too good. A "free Porsche" up North requires winter storage (or snow tires and guts), or a winter beater (requiring, of course, summer storage). One could cycle the cars every season, but one would get dizzy.
During college, I had a mint sport coupe, bought 3 y.o. with high mileage at a good price, and babied it for 6 years. Winter duty came from beaters, along with a few headaches. Still, after 4 winters with a 225$ car, then sold for 400$, the "come out on top" principle still applied. Bought a shiny 1000$ upmarket beater for the two next winters :)
texases says:
07:58 PM, 09/ 6/11
Me, I'd rather have a 'free' $30k Porsche than a 'free' $15k Porsche - I'd have gotten a slightly newer, 100% working, non-salvage title one.
fordson1 says:
06:11 AM, 09/ 7/11
Remember this car is rocking some rust under the paint...in SoCal that is a kiss of death, as most cars there don't have that issue. That may combine with the salvage in the mind of potential buyers.
In my mind, for a car like this, getting a good price depends upon waiting for a foolish-enough person to come along - foolish enough, inexperienced enough, etc.
viss1 says:
07:08 AM, 09/ 7/11
Looks like the old adage still holds true: "911's will cost you $20K, whether you buy a well-sorted one for full price or a cheaper one that needs maintenance/repairs." Of course, that refers to cars with a clean title.
t10 says:
09:14 AM, 09/ 7/11
Real sale prices I know of for turbo looks (84 & 85) in the last year include (not asking):
26,000
24,000
27,000
Those all had under 80K miles.
Lately on Pelican and Panorama prices seems to be in low 30s (asking).