After about four weeks of fielding emails, texts and calls, I sold the Camaro to a young guy from the San Diego area for $28,000. Bryan Mathy asked all the right questions including whether there were any major repairs. I told him about the transmission and he began reading the long term blog. I thought I'd lose him at this point but apparently he felt he was getting a good deal and there aren't many one-and-a-half-year-old Camaros on the market. He said he had been looking for over a month and only found one other serious candidate.
Mathy said he located our Camaro by searching Autotrader, which is nice to know because I spent $49 on the ad. I also advertised on Craigslist and this brought the typical rash of scam-sounding emails. One thing that I tried this time which seemed to be successful was to do a video walk-around of the car and post the link on Youtube. The video got 589 views including Mathy who said it helped him make his decision.
Sunday morning Mathy drove up from San Diego with his girlfriend, Jennifer Bateman, and we met in a shopping center parking lot. He looked over the Camaro and seemed to feel it had been accurately represented in the ad and photos. He didn't even drive it. We chatted for a few minutes and I learned that he had read all the reviews and was aware of the blind spots and the sarcophagus-like back seat. What turned him on, he said, was the car's styling and that, to some degree was what limited its practicality. He said he had never even owned a Chevy before. In fact, this was on the second car that he owned.
We bought the Camaro for $37,425 ($2,000 over the sticker price of $35,425) so it cost us $9,425 for 18 months of fun. Over that period of time, the car depreciated 25 percent.
It's a funny feeling to see the car you've been living in for the past month drive away with someone else at the wheel. I phoned home and waited for my ride. It felt strange -- and oddly convenient -- to climb into the backseat of a four-door car.
Philip Reed, Edmunds senior consumer advice editor @ 22,808 miles
bodyblue says:
08:23 AM, 10/18/10
Poor guy....got a totally abused used car and thinks he got a good deal. But on a lighter note thank goodness the ugly thing is gone. BLAH
thegraduate says:
08:27 AM, 10/18/10
He's read the blog and is aware of the Camaro, good and bad. If the customer and the seller are both happy in the end, it was a good deal.
bodyblue says:
08:36 AM, 10/18/10
" If the customer and the seller are both happy in the end, it was a good deal."
I will have to give you that one. But geeese I would hate to see the rear tires.
blueguydotcom says:
08:45 AM, 10/18/10
You lost more than 25% when you figure CA makes you pay all of the taxes. So if the car was 37k, you actually spent 40k on it and took a 12k hit. Ouch! 30% in 1.5 years.
stress83 says:
09:01 AM, 10/18/10
I don't see what the problem is? Edmunds used the vehicle in the way it was engineered and designed to be used. EVERY auto publication has used their seat time in the Camaro to do the same. There happened to be a case where something malfunctioned, but it was repaired. The car was maintainted according to the maintenance schedule, it was detailed, respected, etc. The buyer saved several thousands, and is happy.
Those who would buy such a car and not explore its capabilities are missing out -- and should have just bought an appliance instead.
1487 says:
09:19 AM, 10/18/10
exactly, any late model Camaro has likely taken some "abuse", if you even want to call it that. It's made to be driven hard.
what is BB going to talk about now that this car is gone? I guess he will turn his vitriol towards the Traverse now.
ocramidajzj says:
09:58 AM, 10/18/10
I think this guy was smart about his purchase. Where else could he buy a high performance car and have such a well-documented history (a visual/play-by play history to boot). I think the LT blog is much better than any title search or by-mouth description of a car's life. As a result this buyer had a very clear idea of what sort of life the Camaro had before he bought it. I doubt he would have gotten such transparency with another transaction.
spaceywilly says:
10:01 AM, 10/18/10
Nice, now he has both his and his girl's first and last name, and his plate numbers on the internet. Some deal!
mrb5091 says:
10:04 AM, 10/18/10
My only criticism (other than echoing what spaceywilly said above) is that he didn't test drive the vehicle. Who would buy a vehicle without test driving it beforehand?
cello_one says:
10:36 AM, 10/18/10
1) mrb5091 - agreed - a quick drive would have been advisable regardless of the history available - maybe they trashed the tranny on the way to the meet.
2) Regardless of history and the expectation that any vehicle with 'SS' on it was beat up, the IL has a whole team of drivers, not just 1 or 2. Each of whom probably put in a fair amount of time flogging the Camaro to its limits. Do it enough and it will be more prone to break...
3) With that said, the new driver accepts the abuse, gets an SS that IS well maintained inside and out and IS well documented without the new car price. - buyer/seller happy with the deal then it is a win.
Note: Sorry IL, I will never by a car from you... might be good for some people, but not me.
eville_stu says:
10:49 AM, 10/18/10
All you people saying how "abused" this car was clearly don't know any Camaro drivers. Every Camaro owner I've know drove their cars extremely hard. I can't imagine IL is any more abusive than some of my friends in high school and college who would seemingly do burnouts at every stop sign and brake stands when we were leaving the school parking lot. I'm guessing this car actually lived a much easier life than 90% of Camaros out there. GM knows who their target audience is and builds this car appropriately to handle this sort of behavior. Everyone speaking of abusive, go back to reading your Prius blog updates and hypermiling in your car appliances. Rant over :)
raspaa says:
10:52 AM, 10/18/10
Is it really necessary to advertise their first AND last names on the web? Not to mention plate number? C'mon Edmunds. Give them some privacy...there's really no need to reveal their names.
Good luck selling cars in the future.
aspade says:
10:54 AM, 10/18/10
Edmunds paid $42,200 out the door. $14,200 for 18 months, or 34%.
What a deal.
oldno7 says:
10:55 AM, 10/18/10
I'm with eville_stu on this one.
The guy bought a car with a fairly well documented and public history. He also bought a Camaro and has no doubt already done his first burnout. It's like none of the people who complain about burnouts being abusive have ever done one or done them well for that matter. Whimps.
theodore2 says:
10:58 AM, 10/18/10
Once again the Challenger Rt shows it value 26600 miles on Rt with only $7100 depreciation! Way to go Dodge! Didn't need a Tranny either!
blueguydotcom says:
11:12 AM, 10/18/10
@aspade,
A deal for that guy but good grief that indicates buying used is often a better deal.
Still not sure who would want to buy a used car that has a rebuilt tranny but to each his own.
fundango says:
11:18 AM, 10/18/10
Interesting point about buying used Edmunds LT cars. On one hand, they do seem to be driven moderately hard with multiple launches, brake tests, slaloms, and skidpads, but on the other hand, you have a detailed description of each car's history and all of the problems it's had thus far. Is it better to buy a used car that's been driven moderately hard but that has an accurate and detailed accident/repair history, or to roll the dice and buy a used car that you know nothing about? I'd say if you're like this buyer and don't want to invest too much effort into inspecting the car, you're better off buying the Edmunds car and paying a bargain price.
zcalvert says:
11:48 AM, 10/18/10
The point many of us make about never buying a long term test car boils down to two things ( I think):
The cars are driven hard daily by a wide variety of drivers who aren't making the payments. I refuse to believe these cars are as well looked after as those owned by some of us who care about and pay for our own cars. I realize that many average car owners probably take worse care of their cars, but supposedly this is a site for enthusiasts, right?
They're subjected to repeated performance testing and/or other competitions that by their nature are abusive to the drivetrains. Some of you are rationalizing and saying that people "ought" to expect that any Camaro has been abused. Maybe. But this one had to have its transmission ripped out and it's a documented fact. For $28k I would expect a history free of major mechanical repairs.
bodyblue says:
12:02 PM, 10/18/10
" Everyone speaking of abusive, go back to reading your Prius blog updates and hypermiling in your car appliances. Rant over :)"
"It's like none of the people who complain about burnouts being abusive have ever done one or done them well for that matter. Whimps."
The Camaro was not designed to be abused every time a driver gets in it and anybody that thinks so either knows nothing about cars or has the mental age of 16 (or both). Zcalvert has is exactly right above. IL beats the holy living hell out of its cars and the failed trans proved it. Buyer beware.
A real auto enthusiast does not abuse equipment....he or she drives sanely and takes care of it like it was a member of the family.....not beaten like a stepchild.
"what is BB going to talk about now that this car is gone? I guess he will turn his vitriol towards the Traverse now. "
Nope, the traverse is way too boring but at least it is not disgustingly ugly like the Camaro. Why do you care anyway? Afraid me and my "ilk" will ruin the sales stats of the Camaro?
ms3fun says:
12:40 PM, 10/18/10
What would really concern me about buying an ex long term car from Edmunds isn't so much the few documented burnouts and other performance tests, but the not documented events of daily life the cars go through. Like the revving to 5000 RPM on a completely cold engine that Donna did with the new BMW 528.
If she did this on video, they probably treat them even worse when nobody is looking and nobody ever knows about it....
teampenske3 says:
12:53 PM, 10/18/10
""what is BB going to talk about now that this car is gone? I guess he will turn his vitriol towards the Traverse now. "
Nope, the traverse is way too boring but at least it is not disgustingly ugly like the Camaro. Why do you care anyway? Afraid me and my "ilk" will ruin the sales stats of the Camaro?"
Here we go again. So predictable, no?
1487 says:
12:54 PM, 10/18/10
"My only criticism (other than echoing what spaceywilly said above) is that he didn't test drive the vehicle. Who would buy a vehicle without test driving it beforehand?"
COnsidering he could track the history of this car based on blog entries what was he going to learn during a test drive? Its a 2010 car, its not a beater.
"Still not sure who would want to buy a used car that has a rebuilt tranny but to each his own."
Only a complete jackass would ignore the fact that the tranny was rebuilt by factory trained techs and the car is STILL under warranty for another 3.5 years. The repair was obviously made to be a permanent one.
"Once again the Challenger Rt shows it value 26600 miles on Rt with only $7100 depreciation! Way to go Dodge! Didn't need a Tranny either!"
No one told IL to overpay for the car. Their depreciation is affected by the fact that they paid over MSRP for the car. Not a smart idea.
This is a 3900lb car with 426hp that was tested in the US, Australia and Europe. Its been tested on the Ring in Germany. Its been subjected to track performance testing by the major magazines. To suggest that a few burnouts and some fast driving count as "abuse" is absurd. What the hell do you people think they are doing during the 3-4 years it takes to develop a car like this? Any car with this much hp, brakes this big and Pirelli tires is made to driven HARD. I'm unaware of any Camaro example showing any signs of fatigue or failure at track days conducted by the major magazines. The fact that today's cars can easily surpass 100k miles if maintained is testament to how rigorously they are developed and how reliable most components in a car have become over time.
Good riddance to this car, I think we're all tired of reading repetitive gripes about the steering wheel and lack of visibility. Anyone for another BMW?
theodore2 says:
01:04 PM, 10/18/10
Thats 14 months of fun 8/10/9 to 10/10/10 at a cost of $9800 or $700 a month not including taxes insurance and 21 days out of service! What a bargain!!!
boostlag says:
01:12 PM, 10/18/10
Please purchase a 2011 Mustang GT with Brembo/3.73 gears to replace the Camaro long term test car.
anythngbutgm says:
01:29 PM, 10/18/10
Second that. 2011 Mustang please.
cubbybear1 says:
02:43 PM, 10/18/10
I'm actually more interested in reading about the new V6 with sport package.
bodyblue says:
03:34 PM, 10/18/10
"No one told IL to overpay for the car. Their depreciation is affected by the fact that they paid over MSRP for the car. Not a smart idea. "
When they got it dealers were not moving on the cars at all....now they are because some of the newness has worn off.
fastboss says:
04:51 PM, 10/18/10
Is it bad that I found the owner's facebook page along with his Girlfriend's page?
wrinklebump says:
08:41 PM, 10/18/10
"Is it bad that I found the owner's facebook page along with his Girlfriend's page?"
uhhh.....yeah.
1487 says:
06:04 AM, 10/19/10
"When they got it dealers were not moving on the cars at all....now they are because some of the newness has worn off."
Yeah I got that. Point is the fact they overpaid is making the resale value look worse. They should've waited a few months.
mrb5091 says:
06:16 AM, 10/19/10
"COnsidering he could track the history of this car based on blog entries what was he going to learn during a test drive? Its a 2010 car, its not a beater."
Would you test drive a car without driving it? I wasn't just speaking just of checking for quality, either. What if he didn't like the driving dynamics, the feel of the shifter, the feel of the seats, etc.?
stress83 says:
07:22 AM, 10/19/10
@mrb5091:
Because he's probably already driven several Camaros and knows what to expect. As pointed out, this is a no-excuses Camaro. If there was a problem with the steering feel, seating, etc, Edmunds would have certainly been quick to bash how horrible this GM car is.
s197gt says:
12:04 PM, 10/19/10
"Yeah I got that. Point is the fact they overpaid is making the resale value look worse. They should've waited a few months. "
i don't think you do. how is paying the market price paying too much?
and why would someone care if their license plate # is displayed for all to see? it's not like they are the president...
664ATO. that's my plate number. a hundred people see it every day. whoopee.
chadders_18 says:
11:16 PM, 12/26/10
You also have to remember the warranty that this camaro has. If it turns out to be a total lemon before the warranty is up, then he should consider extended warranty! And who knows, maybe this guy drives this car harder daily than Edmunds did.