2010 Mazdaspeed 3: Would I Get It Over a Mini Cooper?

Between these two cars, I'd have to go with the MCS. As much as I dislike the odd-looking interior, the rest of the car is very good. A classic hot hatch.

I would also throw the 2009+ WRX into the ring if I was looking. Not as nimble as the other two, but a more forgiving ride. Oh yeah, and 4.8 seconds to 60.

"Interestingly, our old MCS cost $25,220, while our MS3 checks in at $25,840."

Yet people complain about the $15K price for a Fiesta?

Personally, for that kind of money, I'd get something bigger than any of them.

I think it would come down to.. is this your only car?

If I had a one car household then it would be the Mazda. The Mini is too small for a family of 4 and all the things we do.

However since we need two cars anyhow and one has to be able to tow I would choose the Mini as the other over the Mazda to be our small car.

Wish I could edit, I'd love to rephrase the last line of my comment into something less awkward.

"Personally, for that kind of money, I'd get something bigger than any of them."

The MS3 is a bit big and heavy as it is.

I just can´t stand the ugly interior trim of the MS3, its childish exterior and the funky interior of the mini and its MINI size LOL.... so neither.

The MS3 big? Compared to what in America? I had a 2008 MS3 for a while and I found that with the seat adjusted comfortably, there was no more leg room behind me than in the MCS I had before that. Admittedly, I am 6'4", but for me, the extra doors really did not offer much value. The available cargo volume was certainly nice, and it definitely was a better car for hauling more than one passenger, but it is only really a better family car for smaller people.

In retrospect, I would say the MCS was more enjoyable because of its smaller size and the knowledge that it was getting 30% better fuel economy than the MS3. Neither car has the best shifter or clutch, but I think that MS3 would be my pick in that department. I hated the clutch engagement in my MCS so much that I used that to justify the trade. I should have just looked into adjusting it. :)

"The MS3 big? Compared to what in America?"

I'm talking overall length, not space utilization.

Fair enough.

The mini is the passoionatw choice that you will do your best to justify (regarding it's size, that is). There is no denying the mazdas practicality. So it comes down to whether you can get by with the two doors and smaller space. Oh also no stupid Mazda grin is a huge plus.

Well I have not driven a MCS, but based on a test drive of the MS3 last weekend I'll go with that. The car feels high strung and ready to go from the moment you turn the proverbial key (push button). Someone mentioned the speed of the WRX above, but I'll almost guarantee from a 20 mph roll in 2nd gear the MS3 is just as fast as the WRX. I certainly couldn't differentiate between the MS3 and my EVO X from a roll. Fit and finish is quite good, steering is reasonably direct, and I didnt even find the torque steer that distracting. At 25K it's a hell of a value. I'd say it offers at 8 or 9/10ths on the street as much fun as an EVO or STI for a lot less money(sure at the limits or launched hard in a drag race the others are better but who is gonna go there).

No one has mentioned reliability. Has Mini improved? I heard all sorts of horror stories about the Min's electrical system. Then again I hear all sorts of Horror stories about the MS3 and my 08 has been solid as a rock.

I know my wife would like a Mini, but I was at the auto show this weekend and found out the clubmann cost close to 36,000! Is that true? If so price of the Mini is pretty steep.

"No one has mentioned reliability. Has Mini improved? I heard all sorts of horror stories about the Min's electrical system."

Mini has improved a lot in the second generation. I realize that it's anecdotal evidence, but IL's car made it through its year-long term with only one scheduled dealer visit (for a free oil change). There were other issues (cracked windshield and bent rim), but those can't really be blamed on the build quality. I think Automobile Magazine also had one that did pretty well. By the way, the Clubman you were looking at was likely a JCW version, and yes, those are ridiculously priced. The normal Clubman S starts around $24k.

As for the initial question: Even after multiple test drives, I've never really warmed to the MS3. The torque steer, turbo lag, and boomy exhaust coupled with interior and exterior styling that doesn't really appeal to me made for a car that seems like a one-trick-pony. Yes, it's fast. Nothing more to see here. If I needed practicality, I would go for the GTI in a heartbeat. Thing is, I don't really need the practicality, so my monthly payments are going toward a Mini. Like Doug said, the choice was mostly made by the heart, but my head loves the low insurance, great mileage, and free maintenance. I fully admit that it's probably not the best car in the category, but it's the one I have the most fun driving.

"...but I'll almost guarantee from a 20 mph roll in 2nd gear the MS3 is just as fast as the WRX."

I'll agree with you that they're probably about even from a roll. The fastest quarter mile trapspeed I've seen for a 2010 MS3 was 99mph (Edmunds) vs. 101mph for the 09 WRX (MT). Close enough to be about even.

But a 4.8 second 0-60 time is much, much faster than a 6.3 second 0-60. Not to mention, the gap will only widen if you throw in rain, snow, potholes, bumps, slick roads, etc. In real-world everyday driving, the WRX should be faster. (Although I suspect on a track, the MS3 would prevail).

"but a 4.8 second 0-60 time is much, much faster than a 6.3 second 0-60. Not to mention, the gap will only widen if you throw in rain, snow, potholes, bumps, slick roads, etc. In real-world everyday driving, the WRX should be faster. (Although I suspect on a track, the MS3 would prevail)."

But the 4.8 is largely due to AWD launch traction (that has a finite life btw) and MS3's torque management. In the real world (for me anyway) , that is irrelevant since I'm not clutch dumping at a stoplight. Same is true for the all weather stuff. Just because my EVO has tarmac, gravel, or snow modes does not mean I will treat my commute like a rally stage (and I have driven it with almost a foot of snow on the ground).
I was not ready to like the MS3 as much as I did , but I still believe it provides most of the fun to drive quotient of an EVO or STI for much less. I have not driven the 09 version of WRX , but did drive the 08 and can attest that for me I much prefer the MS3's handling (understanding though the tightened up the WRX for 09).

"But the 4.8 is largely due to AWD launch traction (that has a finite life btw) and MS3's torque management. In the real world (for me anyway) , that is irrelevant since I'm not clutch dumping at a stoplight."

Even without clutch-dumping, you should be able to benefit from AWD. Like you (it looks like you've owned an Evo X), I've driven a number of FWD and AWD vehicles. With FWD, any number of factors will conspire against you to make your tires spin on launch: being slightly too aggressive with the throttle/clutch, facing up a hill, wet weather, a bit of gravel on the road, bumps/potholes, cold tires, etc. The thing that always puts a smile on my face with AWD cars is their ability to get the power down in real-world circumstances.

I'd get a vW GTI

" Even without clutch-dumping, you should be able to benefit from AWD. Like you (it looks like you've owned an Evo X), I've driven a number of FWD and AWD vehicles. "

Yes I currently daily drive an EVO X. My exact quote while test driving the MS3 to my passenger was "wow, this thing feels every bit as fast as my EVO". While there is no doubt that certain conditions favor AWD I just dont find I encounter them that much, hense most of the bang for less bucks. I drove a FWD before the EVO (260 /270 tq no less) and though it would spin the wheels more easily I thought the anti-fwd stuff is a bit overblown.

"I'd get a vW GTI"
That seems like a reasonable choice, it's really quite a striking car. Wish IL would get one for their fleet as it seems like an all around interesting car that's attainable for most readers.