2002 BMW M3: Know Your Competition

People who are into old muscle honestly believe that there's nothing new out that there that can compete with them. They literally drive around oblivious to the fact that most any family sedan these days with a V6 can give a number of the old "muscle cars" out there a run for their money.

I don't know why you bothered to race against him at all, I can guarantee you he didn't learn anything.

I think he was looking for revenge - probably one of the fools that tried the same thing on me while I was in the Nissan GT-R. The Mustang dude's girlfriend probably told him he has a really fast car and he believed it.

Have that mole looked at NOW!
Not trying to scare you, but....NOW!

Can someone IP ban kissel1? It's getting old.

That's one of the things I DO like about the Mazdaspeed 3, most of the yahoos around here still have no earthly idea what it is; Slammed/Fart-Canned Ricers, Mullet-Heads in their rumbling 'Murrican Iron- it makes no difference; I murder 99% of them. I'm having almost as much fun as I did with my E24 M6. I NEVER lost a Stoplight Grand Prix with that car(dropping the cat and adding a Dinan chip worked wonders). Of course, there WAS a 911 Turbo that challenged me from a 30 mph roll- but I pretended not to see him. Hey, a man's got to know his limitations...

See, I actually enjoy losing to a truly fast car when it's an open straight and we're just having fun.

Case in point, I loved it when a SN95 Mustang Cobra (I think it was the one that was rated at 390 HP, and underrated at that) started to rev at my 2006 Civic SI at a stoplight. I absolutely revved back.

There is something absolutely awe-inspiring when you are gunning it and the vibrations from the car next to you overwhelm the sound of your own engine, as it rockets past you as if you were driving in reverse. It puts true speed into perspective.

Nice work, Caroline!

Wish you had a video of it.

The funniest thing happened a few years ago when my wife and I were coming back from an autocross event I and some friends participated in. Some "good ole boys" were trying to get me to race them (we were in my tastefully Integra powered Civic) and they were in an S10 that obviously was V8 powered, probably a "three fit-tee".

4 lights. The first 2 lights my wife said I couldnt challenge them so I didnt. The 3rd light she was a bit frustrated with all the noise they were creating and just gave me that one raised eyebrow look (you married guys know what Im talking about) to dispose of the "good ole boys". I revved her to 4500RPM and let the LSD and the Falken Azenis' get traction. By the time VTEC struck their front fender was at the rear of my Civic and I was still in 1st gear which is super short. Anyone whos familiar with 4cyl DOHC VTEC Hondas knows that they really dont hit their stride until 3rd gear. That was too easy.

We get to the last light (4th) and the decide to make a right turn. Before doing so the S10 driver revs the sh*t out of the S10 and the radiatior and fan assembly litterally slid accross the intersection! Ive never laughed so hard in my life!

hondacura4- LOL! Great story. We have similsr spouses; here's an excerpt from an old story I wrote on the 645Ci convertible:

In my twenty-two years of BMW ownership I have owned several that have sported a somewhat-ahem-aggressive appearance. Every now and then it seems that the combination of color and various M Technic add-ons tend to awaken a competitive streak in certain other drivers. Well, let me tell you- nothing I've ever driven has brought the squirrels out of the trees like this Mystic Blue 645Ci droptop. Nothing.
I had my first encounter less than six hours after the car was delivered. My son and I were sitting at a light when a be-winged, be-skirted, and coffee-canned Eclipse pulled up. The driver began goosing his flatulent-sounding motor-no doubt intending to impress his female passenger with the tri-colored hair and double-pierced nose. When the light changed I left on about 3/4 throttle-which was more than enough to leave him for dead-and I backed off at 45 mph(I did. REALLY!). The next day it was some hooligan in a Hemi powered half-ton Dodge Ram. Yes, a truck. He left the light with the rear tires squealing, but by the time he crossed the intersection I was already in the next county. Other unlucky contestants included a couple of late model Mustang GTs, a Z28, and what seemed to be the entire vehicular cast of The Fast and the Furious. It got so bad towards the end that my kid looked over at one Mustang in the next lane and advised the driver, "Don't even THINK about it." As a matter of fact, the only challenger who tasted victory was some doofus in a Jaguar XJ8. You see, my wife was in the car that time-so when my son announced, "Dad, that guy's an idiot; you're gonna SMOKE him." my Better Half replied, "Dad's not going to race him, ARE YOU DAD?" "Of course not, dear", I assured her. The light turned green, and the Jag hammered off into the night. That punk will never know just how lucky he was...

Good stuff Caroline. I get the same thing in mine pretty regularly. A lot of times I'll just let it slide, but if someone's doing something like staying glued to my bumper (exceedingly common), I just don't feel safe and will put some area codes between us with a quickness. Dropping into 3rd at 70mph is always a lot of fun. ;)

The greatest feeling as a married man is when my wife comes home and tells me how she smoked someone trying to race her, in her Legacy GT.

She's basically given me the greenlight to take her to Stage 2, as I told her she'd be able to race recent Porsches, BMW M3s, and a wide variety of Mustang GTs with confidence at that point.

God i love being married to her.

"Honestly though, what was he thinking? I'm in an M3. Hello?"-Caroline.
That made my morning. Congrats on the victory! Its the little things in life you know. Why was he trying to get(merge) into your lane? That seems kinda dangerous.

Idk where you all live, but I've had my M3 for 7 months now (First in Iowa, now in Louisville) and I've only had one person ever challenge me.

I kinda wish I had more idiots pull up next to me and rev, because then I wouldn't look like such an coc* when I launch away from the stoplights, alone, for no apparent reason to the other drivers. Maybe they take heed of my aggressive driving and just stay away!?

"Honestly though, what was he thinking? I'm in an M3. Hello?"-Caroline.
That made my morning. Congrats on the victory! Its the little things in life you know. Why was he trying to get(merge) into your lane? That seems kinda dangerous.

Idk where you all live, but I've had my M3 for 7 months now (First in Iowa, now in Louisville) and I've only had one person ever challenge me.

I kinda wish I had more idiots pull up next to me and rev, because then I wouldn't look like such an coc* when I launch away from the stoplights, alone, for no apparent reason to the other drivers. Maybe they take heed of my aggressive driving and just stay away!?

Hi tenfifteen, good to seem someone outside the m3forum ;)

"Honestly though, what was he thinking? I'm in an M3. Hello?"-Caroline.
That made my morning. Congrats on the victory! Its the little things in life you know. Why was he trying to get(merge) into your lane? That seems kinda dangerous.

Idk where you all live, but I've had my M3 for 7 months now (First in Iowa, now in Louisville) and I've only had one person ever challenge me.

I kinda wish I had more idiots pull up next to me and rev, because then I wouldn't look like such an coc* when I launch away from the stoplights, alone, for no apparent reason to the other drivers. Maybe they take heed of my aggressive driving and just stay away!?

Hi tenfifteen, good to seem someone outside the m3forum ;) Oh and Joefrompa, definitely sounds like a keeper!

Uh wow, sorry about the triple post :( my browser was on the fritz. If there's a moderator, please remove them. Sorry guys.

joefrompa, is your wife's Legacy GT modded? They're reasonably fast, but any E46 M3 with a non-feeb at the wheel should be able to p*** on a Legacy with absolute impunity.

"By youngdriver on March 5, 2009 11:35 AM
People who are into old muscle honestly believe that there's nothing new out that there that can compete with them."

That's not true at all, and you're incorrectly stereotyping all old muscle car owners.

And for the record, there are quite a few old muscle cars that will beat the E46 M3 in a straight line, including 1960's Mustangs such as the Shelby GT500KR, Boss 429, as well as numerous modified Mustangs. There are Mustangs, and then there are MUSTANGS. Caroline happened to come across a tame one.

Then there are 1960's cars like the Shelby Cobra 427, and Ford GT40 that will not only smoke an E46 M3 in a straight line, but also out-handle it and embarrass it on a road course.

"By hondacura4 on March 5, 2009 6:43 PM
The funniest thing happened a few years ago when my wife and I were coming back from an autocross event I and some friends participated in. Some "good ole boys" were trying to get me to race them (we were in my tastefully Integra powered Civic) and they were in an S10 that obviously was V8 powered, probably a "three fit-tee". "

You're bragging about racing and beating an old S-10 pickup truck with your "VTEC" Civic? Are you kidding me? That's like bragging about beating a Smart.

When you're ready to try racing a real V-8, let me know...

Stingray - I've gotten raced by some chevy pick-up trucks with small block v8s dropped into them. He appears to be "bragging" about the guys being idiots and losing their radiator.

Besides which, I've seen plenty of those trucks running low 13s :)

Tenfifteen said, "joefrompa, is your wife's Legacy GT modded? They're reasonably fast, but any E46 M3 with a non-feeb at the wheel should be able to p*** on a Legacy with absolute impunity."

If you noticed, I agreed with you. I said that once I modify it to Stage 2, she'll be ready to race e46 M3s. A Stage 2 legacy GT (opened up exhaust and tune) will run about the same 0-60 and 1/4 mile times as a e46 M3 (stock). In other words, she'll probably still lose but it won't be embarassing....she'll actually give them a run for their money :)

And once she's at Stage II, how hard will it be to convince her we "need" that upgraded turbo, injectors, fuel pump, and intercooler? :)

A Stage II LGT runs roughly 250 awhp at 5000-5500 rpms and 300 awtq at 3200 rpms. It can be done for as long as $200....my version will cost about $350-400. The only thing whose life is really shortened is the stock clutch, which was already weak.

I'm just waiting to get closer to end of warranty to unleash this bad boy :)

"The greatest feeling as a married man is when my wife comes home and tells me how she smoked someone trying to race her, in her Legacy GT.
She's basically given me the greenlight to take her to Stage 2, as I told her she'd be able to race recent Porsches, BMW M3s, and a wide variety of Mustang GTs with confidence at that point.
God i love being married to her."

Joe,sounds a lot like my wife since I purchased our 2002 S2000 back in 2005 for our...I mean her...ahem... anniversary present. Shes been bit by the tuner bug to the point of me taking the AP1 off her hands and looking for her own AP2 S2000 to modify and autocross. YES, I love this woman! Keep in mind this was her idea not mine.

"You're bragging about racing and beating an old S-10 pickup truck with your "VTEC" Civic? Are you kidding me? That's like bragging about beating a Smart."

Stingray, you obviously took my post the wrong way as it CLEARLY wasn't for bragging rights. I was simply explaining a situation that was similar in concept to the subject of this thread. I could care less who was faster but obviously he wanted a challenge and he was defeated, VTEC, V8, "REAL V8", V6, I4, quad turbo 8.0L V16, import or domestic....whatever. As the "good ole boys" say here in Kentucky "run what you brung"!

I could also bring up another story about the kid revving on my wife in her Odyssey and her revving back. The best part about that story is the fact that the Eclipse he was driving wasn't boosted (it was clearly a GS w/ GS-T badging). The funny part was there was an intercooler zip tied to the grill inside bumper with no connected plumbing in site......hmmmmmm. Maybe that wasn't a "real 4cyl"? The big Ody came away the victor!

"That's not true at all, and you're incorrectly stereotyping all old muscle car owners."

Sting, you basically did the same thing in regards to my post. I don't believe in double standards.

"When you're ready to try racing a real V-8, let me know..."

My apologies for not meeting your expectations of a "typical ricer" as I have respect for a lot of performance cars regardless of country of origin or when they were manufactured. I'm clearly not 1 dimensional when it comes to manufacturers and I think Ive proven that on these boards as Ive relentlessly raved about the new CTS-V and ZR1 as they are simply MARVELOUS!

I could care less if you have a "real V8" waiting as the performance goals I set for my project (my old 1995 Civic sedan) have been met and for the most part exceeded. I'm selling it soon to start on my AP1 S2000 (turbocharged or supercharged, I'm not sure as of yet) as I want something that had more potential from the start and for the fact that my hunger for more potential power/torque and much better all around performance has grown tremendously. I also wanted something that had a super stiff chassis, nimble tactile handling, great steering/shift quality, super high revving engine, reliability and refinement. I didn't have to look far as it was in my garage.

Again, I could care less if you have a "real V8" as long as my projects meet or exceed my expectations.I hope your projects do the same for you, happy motoring. =)

"Idk where you all live, but I've had my M3 for 7 months now (First in Iowa, now in Louisville) and I've only had one person ever challenge me."

DRMillerM3, I'm not too far from Louisville (Im assuming youre in Kentucky) as I live in Versailles. I'm about an hour from Louisville...welcome! BTW, if you see a black guy who looks like Montel Williams in a black/black 335i sedan thats been slightly lowered with 19inch BBS rims thats my lil' brother..say hello. =)

hondacura4 - I obviously took your original post the wrong way. My apologies.

I admit when I'm wrong. ;)

While we're on the topic of funny racing stories, I had some idiot in a riced out early model Acura Integra, equipped with wing, stickers, and huge fart pipe, rev at me at red light while I was in my '99 Suburban diesel. I guess the 4" exhaust I have on my truck pushed his buttons.

So I was like what the hell, let's see what the old truck will do. Why not, right? He had his window down, so I was actually just hoping to fog the inside of his car with black diesel soot hehehe... Well, not only did I do that, but I easily beat him from a stop all the way up to about 40 MPH. He finally caught up and passed me after that. I was LMAO. Then the next light, we go again. Same exact result - he's chirping his tires, shifting at redline, giving it all it's got, and I just pull away from him while filling his car with black diesel soot. Did it a THIRD time, and same result. It was really funny seeing this little riced out Integra getting beat by a 6,800 lbs. diesel Suburban. Up to 40 MPH anyway - he always pulled past me after that. Good demonstration of the complete opposite engines running - mine with huge low-end torque but low HP at redline, his with very little low-end torque, but high HP at redline.

drmillerM3- I live in the Louisville area as well. Shoot me a PM at my CarSpace address if you need a heads-up on good BMW shops. And come out to our CCA Chapter's June HPDE.

The latest victims of the MS3 were a couple of punks in an extremely riced 240SX. The driver floored it when I pulled out to pass them. My wife wasn't with me so I returned fire. In an instant I pulled on the morons by something like 8-10 cars. When I checked the speedo I was waaay north of 100 mph. Whoops...
When I slowed down they pulled up alongside trying to figure out how this dull blue station wagon annihilated them without even breaking a sweat. My son said he could see their lips moving as they tried to read the Mazdaspeed badge.

git it girrl!

I'm suprised more people haven't tried racing me, maybe its cause there are so many cops in Irvine. My car *2005 RSX Type S* has the whole aspec kit from the previous owner. It looks pretty cool to me but I imagine it attracts a lot of unwanted attention, but I don't want to pay to remove it either. But it is kinda sad how the ratios are so close together and the lack of torque from the engine. To sound like a normal person you have to shift at ~3000 but if you give it any throttle, you'll be at 4,000 rpms easy so from a stoplight I'm almost always the slowest car.

While I'm more of an import person, I have respect for any fast car regardless of what category it falls under.