2009 VW Jetta TDI: More Fun Than It Looks

How does the _standard_ 10-speaker system sound? It's Blaupunkt right?

I wish all cars came standard with a decent speaker setup like this.
The Prius vs TDI comparo's right. You get stuff standard in a VW that you pay a good amount extra for in other cars. Except the leather. No leather available in this car.

Wait I'm talking about a $23k compact car... at $23k most compact cars are loaded. It's not that cheap then. Little more than the competition since the competition has leather + nav at $23k.

Expensivest except 2nd to the terrible Prius.

Once you experience strong low-end torque, there's no going back!

Its expensive for a compact car, but not for one with a diesel. diesel engines always raise the price considerably.

And, once your ready to sell this car, the diesel engine will command a premium, even if it has well over 100k.

"Once you experience strong low-end torque, there's no going back!"

low end torque is over-rated. The low RPM range still means in has a relatively low HP rating. As soon as it gets going, it's out of steam.

"Its expensive for a compact car, but not for one with a diesel. diesel engines always raise the price considerably."

That's BS...In Europe, a diesel Jetta cost about same as a gas engine (TSi) Jetta. It would be more accurate to say that in the U.S., diesel engines always raise the price considerably.

"And, once your ready to sell this car, the diesel engine will command a premium, even if it has well over 100k."

That's true, since there are such few TDi(s) being sold in comparison to gas Jettas. So it's a matter of supply and demand.

jahfakin....Yes, most diesel engines (the BMW an exception) do run out of steam much much earlier than the comparable gas engine. But if you're a good driver you can drive at a very fast rate safely on public roads and have fun at the same time while keeping under 3000 rpm. Its called anticipating traffic flow and scanning the road far ahead of you. Its a better indicator of driving skill than someone who just mashes the throttle and the brakes.

dino6,

"Its called anticipating traffic flow and scanning the road far ahead of you. Its a better indicator of driving skill than someone who just mashes the throttle and the brakes."

yeah, I know about that already....that comes natural to anyone who drives stick (manual).

"But if you're a good driver you can drive at a very fast rate safely on public roads and have fun at the same time while keeping under 3000 rpm"

that's true too....any care, regardless of HP is capable of getting you above the speed limit, and therefore into trouble.

my point is, you will not get nearly as much thrill from a diesel as you would a gas engine. despite it's high torque, you have to deal with the serious lag. And when you mash the pedal, the car doesn't just accelerate rapidly, it moves with a lazy feeling. Not turtle slow, but it has a very relaxed feeling to it. and when it starts to get going.....you are out of RPM.

"That's true, since there are such few TDi(s) being sold in comparison to gas Jettas. So it's a matter of supply and demand."

That always seems weird to me. Just north of your border, the TDI has been the top selling VW engine choice for years.

"low end torque is over-rated. The low RPM range still means in has a relatively low HP rating. As soon as it gets going, it's out of steam"

And gas engines of a comparable size are out of steam at low engines speeds.... right where you need them in normal driving.

It all depends on what type of driver you are. If you drive like a boy racer, winding it out to the redline everytime then gas is better.

For everyone else diesel is better.

"That always seems weird to me. Just north of your border, the TDI has been the top selling VW engine choice for years."

Yeah, U.S. sucks like that. Americans have this thing in their heads that diesel is only for commercial/duty vehicles. Which is total BS.

"And gas engines of a comparable size are out of steam at low engines speeds.... right where you need them in normal driving."

hmmm...that makes no sense to me. My 2.4L NA Toyota engine stays at 3.5k RPM or less 90% of the time. Most gas engines have no issues operating at low engine speeds, especially on the high way. it's not like people are towing boats with these cars, so the low-end torque is 2nd to HP for the average driver.

"It all depends on what type of driver you are. If you drive like a boy racer, winding it out to the redline everytime then gas is better."

Actually, the broader the powerband the less likely you are to redline your engine. When I had my TDi, I was revving it up to 4K (beyond that the engine flattens out) quite often. With my gas engine, I almost never make it to the 7K limit.

I'm not saying that the TDi cannot get up and go. We know it can, in it's own way. I'm just saying that when it comes to spirited driving, it's far from ideal. The limitations of the engine just make it so. The sweet spot is only between 1750-3500 RPM.

If you want a performance 2L engine...there is the GTi engine or the Honda Civic Si....both in the same price range and both will fly like a bat out of hell....but they burn more fuel than the TDi.

"By jahfakin on February 10, 2009 2:01 PM

low end torque is over-rated. The low RPM range still means in has a relatively low HP rating. As soon as it gets going, it's out of steam."

Try driving one before making such foolish comments.

So you shift at 4k RPM instead of 8k RPM. It's not out of steam, it's just different. Revving a diesel doesn't get you much other than more noise. You soon learn you don't NEED to rev a diesel. There is no "gets going" - it already is going the moment you turn it on. Full power right off of idle. I guess you would rather have to wait to have full power?

OK, now I see jahfakin supposedly owned a TDI before, so I'm perplexed why he made such a foolish comment about low-end torque being overrated??? Weird.

I've never heard of anyone say "I hate all that low-end torque! It's just bad!" LOL

"hmmm...that makes no sense to me. My 2.4L NA Toyota engine stays at 3.5k RPM or less 90% of the time. Most gas engines have no issues operating at low engine speeds, especially on the high way."

That's why I said a gas engine of comparable size. The 2.4 is a larger engine then the 2.0 TDI and uses 50% more fuel (Edmunds tests, 24mpg for a 4 cyl Camry vs 36mpg for a TDI Jetta.)

A couple years ago I drove a 1.8 Integra back to back with a 1.9 Golf TDI. As long as you kept the revs above 4000 rpm, the Integra was faster. Driven normally the Golf walked away from it every time.

stingray454,

So you have resorted to calling people names? Really mature. I'm far from being a fool. I've given my opinion as a TDi owner of 6 years, and if you don't like it, then so what.

I didn't say ""I hate all that low-end torque! It's just bad!", Maybe you misread something I wrote.

As for your comment "You soon learn you don't NEED to rev a diesel. There is no "gets going" - it already is going the moment you turn it on. Full power right off of idle. I guess you would rather have to wait to have full power?"

Yes it's true with a TDi you learn to drive with torque, and not HP....but that's not aways practical. As for not waiting for full power, well that's not entirely true either. You have to wait for the Garrett VNT turbo to spool, and that can be a long...long lag. depending on the circumstances. Me (and many others) have even resorted to a mufflerectomy to try and reduce the lag time.

jahfakin, I took an extended test drive of this new 2009 Jetta TDI. It is nothing like the older ones. It's a lot faster. Really a lot. As soon as the Rabbit/Golf hits with the new TDI, I'm trading up.