2009 Mazda 6 i Grand Touring: Light steering

Any reasons why you left the Nissan Altima out of your equation, or for that matter Ford Fusion? Are they not mainstream enough?

If auto writers think the new 6 is too soft then that means Mazda got the tuning just right. Zoom Zoom gets annoying pretty fast if your roads aren't good so a little more refinement probably made this car a winner. I haven't driven one but rode as a passenger and the ride quality seemed nice. I would replace my 3 with one but I want something a little more different than what I've had for the last 4 years.

Hopefully Mazda will right their wrong in mainstreaming the new 6 by offering two trim levels: 6b (as in bland) with numbness for the masses, and a 6s for people who want a sportier setup. The 's' should have a firmer suspension and tighter steering feel.

@Paul

Isn't the diver's car of the mid-size class the Nissan Altima? (Which has spot-on steering BTW)

Try the Camry with the sport package. The steering feel and effort are surprisingly good.

Mazda needs to change it's slogan from "Zoom Zoom Zoom" to "bigger, heavier, uglier, more expensive, and less useful." My 2007 6i 5-door is my third Mazda since 1983, and my last until they realize they're better off keeping the customers they have instead chasing customers who aren't interested. They tried it with the 1997 626 and it didn't work, resulting in the 2002 Atenza/6; maybe we'll be so lucky this time.

On one hand it's a shame for driving enthusiasts to lose their stand-by in the family sedan class, but on the other hand, what self-respecting driving enthusiast is shopping for cars in this segment in the first place? There are gonna be some people who say "oh, hold on, wait a minute, I HAD to get a family sedan and I wanted to best one to drive I could get".

Bull. If you care about performance enough, you don't HAVE to get stuck in any segment you don't want to be in. "Performance" in a family sedan is only to sell it to the weak-kneed wannabes, which is a niche market Mazda is smart not to chase since it is represented predominantly by hypothetical people invented by automotive journalists to complain about how they're not driving a Porsche that week.

I still pine for the world model. The US 6 hits every bad 'Americanized' check box. Bigger, heavier, uglier, blander...

It's sad because most of Mazda's current success is due to the Mazda 3. A car they specifically gave us on the latest and greatest world platform, when Ford cheaped out on the American consumer and gave us an old Focus. You'd think they'd have taken something away from that, but they let Ford keep them on the old 6 platform for the US car.

No zoom zoom in the new 6. :(

I haven't driven one yet, but if Paul's right, that's too bad. The steering in my '03 6s is maybe my favorite part about that car, with a fantastic balance between easy to use and firm & weighted. Best in any everyday car I've driven outside of a BMW.

It's okay if you don't like this family car.
The new Mazda3 is here in 2 months! Achieving an Edmunds slalom time of 68.2 mph with but a baby 167 hp engine! Now that's a fast zoom-zoom car!

Best of all, the Mazda 3 feels almost just as big for the driver! Compact car, done European proportions.

Mazda3 is a family car? Maybe for a family of three.

The funny thing is, you didn't even mention the Altima, which has the best steering feel in this class.

It is one of the top 10 best selling vehicles in the United States. Is it not mainstream enough for you?

It's a sad day when a Nissan beats a Mazda in driving feel.

altimadude, outside of BigMac-World, the Mazda3 hatch is a normal family car. And it's got more usable interior space than say...an Altima.

How many of you actually own a Mazda6?

"My 2007 6i 5-door is my third Mazda since 1983, and my last until they realize they're better off keeping the customers they have instead chasing customers who aren't interested. They tried it with the 1997 626 and it didn't work, resulting in the 2002 Atenza/6; maybe we'll be so lucky this time."

1960, I totally agree. I own a 2003 6 and it still drives great...love the communicative handling.

I live in Orange County, CA and was invited to a focus group at Mazda's USA headquarters in Irvine. They wanted us to evaluate the new models. When I sat in the new 6, I told them I was disappointed in the re-design. They didn't like that one bit. But hey, they chose to deviate from the formula that brought Mazda back from a coma. While the Mazda3 may be selling hot right now, the Mazda 6 came along and reinvented the company.

"On one hand it's a shame for driving enthusiasts to lose their stand-by in the family sedan class, but on the other hand, what self-respecting driving enthusiast is shopping for cars in this segment in the first place?"

Hey grandma...I mean clarkma...that is a rather snobbish comment. Some of us real driving enthusiasts want a daily driver. Enough said.

Mazda3...hehe. I test drove one. I guess it could work for you if you were 5 feet tall. Can you imagine what would happen to an average sized American occupant if you were to smash into the tail end of a semi-truck with one of those smallish cars? I don't want my wife driving it. Thanks.

"Mazda3...hehe. I test drove one. I guess it could work for you if you were 5 feet tall. Can you imagine what would happen to an average sized American occupant if you were to smash into the tail end of a semi-truck with one of those smallish cars? I don't want my wife driving it. Thanks."

Smaller cars are the future. I wish North America would embrace them sooner. Its something to look forward to, I guess.

@BlueGuyDotCom
The Hatch has a little more usable cargo space, but passenger space? A-b-s-o-l-u-t-e-l-y not. As a 6'2 individual, the back seat on the 3 is only suitable for short trips.

@Clarkma
It's called a daily driver. Mid-size sedans make a lot of sense for many because they have broad appeal and are reasonably versatile (though I'm partial to wagons). Some of us want a sedan but don't want it to be boring and can't quite swing a payment on a G35.b

The 6 was hardly saving grace for Mazda, it NEVER sold like they wanted it to or even close to it. I was in one for a week. If you all are SO worried about handling get some coilovers and a rear sway bar.

@ CX7-

If you read closely, the beef here is with the 6's steering feel, not the suspension.

@ CX7-

If you read closely, the beef here is with the 6's steering feel, not the suspension.

If you read the comments, it's with the handling overall.

In today's automotive climate, having a car that appeals to the masses is the only way to go in this class. Sure, they could have kept the original formula, but they would have also kept its disappointing sales figures. I can't blame Mazda one bit... they tried to appeal to the enthusiasts, but the enthusiasts went elsewhere. And then they tried appealing even more to the enthusiast with the Mazdaspeed6, which was an absolute sales failure.

As for the comment about the Mazda6 reinventing the company... not even close. I used to sell Mazdas, and potential customers complained about the 6's small backseats, noisy ride, and too much road feel through both the suspension and steering wheel. The Mazda3 (and previously the third-generation Protege) reinvented their North American image. Mazda had to slap huge incentives to move the 6 off the lots, especially if it wore a Mazdaspeed badge.

jstandefer

Exactly, I mean you all can moan about how it doesn't handle as sharply, but it clearly wasn't a winning formula on the dealer lots.

Re. "In terms of day-to-day usefulness, the newly re-jiggered Mazda 6 is as innocuously functional as your everyday Camry or Accord."

Yep. I was afraid of that. Buh-bye zoom-zoom, hello novacaine. RIP Mazdaspeed 6 - you were a honey of a sports sedan.

"Innocuously functional" doesn't have much of a catchy ring for the commercials, but then again, the truth doesn't have much of a place in advertising anyway.

Jaeger

It wasn't that long ago it seemed the mid-size class had everything you could possibly want, from HUGE BARGE (Camry) to Muscle car (Altima) to Audi Killer (Subaru Legacy) to well rounded sporty (Accord) to full-out sports sedan (Mazda 6), and then there was the domestic lineup (Ford's polished Fusion... GM was kinda MIA.)

Now it's kind of like everything is bloating up and out. First the Accord went, now the Mazda 6. The Subaru Legacy is going to go next- snatch them up while you can. That leaves only the Altima as the enthusiast-minded choice.

"It's sad because most of Mazda's current success is due to the Mazda 3"

I guess that is why the new one is smiling from ear to ear...

I rented a 6 about a year ago and on back roads and twisty mountain highways it was a blast. It was composed and fun. I had a lot of hope for the new 6. I haven't driven a new one yet but now I wish I had stopped by a dealer to check out some of the clearance sales on the old one.

I was really waiting for the new 3 but can't get past the grin, complete with nose and two eyes. It looks like a jack-o-lantern!.
I was told I can't get one with "STPDGRN" for a license plate.

I have yet to see a new 6 on the road and I live in a Mazda town, the old 6's and 3's are everywhere and even a couple Protege5's.

How do the dimensions on the Fusion match up? It is supposed to be the same platform as the old 6 and I see a lot of those on the road. It doesn't seem to be sized to compare with an Accord or Camry. I read somewhere that the Fusion was doing great for selling to the people that would stop and testdrive one because they are more fun to drive than an Accord and Camry so there are people looking for that.

Mazda needs better advertising, did the average consumer know what a Mazda6 was? I've seen a few commercials for the new 6 but I don't remember much of anything for the old one.
My favorite was the old Protege5 commercial where they hardly mentioned the name of the car, let alone risked showing the name on the screen. I had someone tell me about a great car commercial they saw, but couldn't for the life of them remember what the car was and it was that P5 commercial. And that was a car guy.

People keep saying that they had to change because the old one wasn't selling enough, but was it not selling because people just weren't shopping for a Mazda when they thought 4-door family sedan or was it not selling because they test drove it and decided it was too small? So were they only getting the few people looking for some fun in their car specifically looking at the Mazda? And now they've let go of those shoppers?

Anyone have sales stats on the Mazda6? Is the new one selling very well? Subtract 30% from its sales and compare them to the old 6 at this time last year, to figure in for overall drop in sales.

Found some stats. For December of 2008 they sold 3,088 Mazda6s and in 2007 they sold 4,485. A drop of 31.1%. Overall they dropped 26.8% (13.3% in cars only) but it is hard to tell if the 31% drop is bad or not since the CX7 dropped 66.4% and the RX-8 dropped 51.4% but the Mazda3 only dropped 15.3% and the Mazda5 went up 77.4%
Overall I'd say the Mazda6 sales aren't any stronger than the old one since the 2007 stats were on a car that hadn't been updated in awhile.

I don't know if this will cut and paste so if it doesn't space right I apologize. But here are the dimensions of the 2008 Fusion, 2008 Mazda6 and 2008 328i:
Fusion Mazda6 328i
Passenger Capacity 5 5 5
Passenger Volume (ft³) 100.7 96.1 93.0
Front Head Room (in) 38.7 38.7 38.5
Front Leg Room (in) 42.3 42.3 41.5
Front Shoulder Room (in)57.4 55.9 55.4
Front Hip Room (in) 54.0 54.7 N/A
Second Head Room (in) 37.8 37.1 37.5
Second Leg Room (in) 37.5 36.5 34.6
Second Shoulder Room(in)56.5 55.2 55.1
Second Hip Room (in) 53.3 54.1 N/A

No, I don't think they are in the same class as the BMW, it is just there for size comparison and because I often wish that more car makers would make a good car that size.
By comparison the 2009 Mazda 6 (not shown) has 4cf more volume, .7" more front headroom, .2" more front legroom, 1.4" more front shoulder room, .4" more front hiproom, .2" more rear head room, 1.5" more rear legroom, 1.3" more rear shoulder room and 1.8" more rear hip room. None of those number seem that much more impressive.

Sorry for making everyone nod off with all the numbers.

Mazda is in the business of selling cars. Honda and Toyota sell twice as many of those big heavy Camrys and Accords than Mazda does with the 6. As much as you may hate it they have to build cars that they market wants. That means more room for the family and their junk, more compliant suspension and less twitchy (tight responsive) steering. To their credit I think they have done a good job of making a comprimise in the engineering of the car but it is not as attractive as the old one.

"Mazda needs better advertising, did the average consumer know what a Mazda6 was? I've seen a few commercials for the new 6 but I don't remember much of anything for the old one."

tmanz - you are absolutely correct. This is also the problem with domestics right now. The Pontiac G8 GT, for example, is absolutely on par (and an enthusiasts' car, too) with many foreign nameplates and the advertising by GM is just not gonna close the deal.

jstandefer - you should check out some professional reviews of the 6 and take a look at the numerous international awards it has won since its inception. Are you telling me that it was not a massive improvement over the 626, which was selling fewer units than the Hyundai Sonata years ago? It was such a breath of fresh air for Mazda that Ford used its platform for the Fusion, Mercury Milan, and Lincoln MKZ. The Mazda3 is a good car in that segment, but was absolutely helped by skyrocketing fuel prices.

CX7 - and are you telling us that the CX7 was the saving grace for Mazda? You don't like that us Mazda6 owners are disappointed in the new 6 model because it abandoned its sportiness. Well, I don't see a hallavalotta new Mazda6 cars on the road. It's fatter than ever and got the poorest mpg in the segment.

All of this makes me go HMMM...about the new Mazda6.

Just for the record, something else that really bothers me about the new Mazda6 is the V6. The horse power is the same as the planned performance for the upcoming MazdaSpeed6. It is said to be a 4 cyl power plant with a turbo charger, which yields the same horse power as the current V6. Huh? Then, really, what's the point of the MazdaSpeed? Someone please tell me. CX7, you seem to be a proud Mazda advocate. What say you?

I have an '03 that is still a blast to drive. One of the best parts has always been the unusually good steering feel and responsiveness. I have not driven the new car. I'm not excited about it very much at all. I bought mine as a truly sporting alternative to everything else that was in the same price point. Now it's grown too big to be fun and reading this only further makes me wish that we had the new Jap/Euro spec model. Oh, well. I've done enough things to mine to keep it entertaining for a few more years (read: springs, sways, struts/shocks, wheels, intake and exhaust)!

"...the upcoming MazdaSpeed6. It is said to be a 4 cyl power plant with a turbo charger, which yields the same horse power as the current V6. Huh?" By blobster - It's simple. A nice, peaky turbocharged 4 cylinder hanging out front gives the car better weight bias. Add to that some more sporting chassis revisions and (possibly?) AWD and it will simply make for a more balanced package at the limit. As long as they put the last Speed6's reliability issues to bed once and for all, it could make this new 6 fun to drive. We'll see.

CX7 - and are you telling us that the CX7 was the saving grace for Mazda? You don't like that us Mazda6 owners are disappointed in the new 6 model because it abandoned its sportiness. Well, I don't see a hallavalotta new Mazda6 cars on the road. It's fatter than ever and got the poorest mpg in the segment.

Why would I say that? You are aware that the CX-7 came out much later than the 3, 6, MX-5, and the 5? You don't like it but CLEARLY the majority of shoppers didn't. The sales are in decrease for ALL, the new 6 having a drop in sales over the old means nothing. Why would you see a ton of new 6's on the road, THEY JUST CAME OUT.
The CX-7 met and beat it's first year sales goal. Can't say that for the Mazda6.
I'm starting to think you're either slow or just stupid.

MazdaSpeed6 is highly unlikely to happen again unless it's FWD and cheap.

"Mazda is in the business of selling cars"

but, my question is will the changes sell more cars? They used to play a different game than the Accord and Camry but now that they are playing the same game, can they take more sales away from them? Or are people just programmed to automatically go buy one of those two cars?

The G8 is a great example of people not knowing about the car. I read a comment somewhere that it should have been the new Impalla. I wonder if it had taken a known name like that if they would be selling way more of them.

I like the MPG of the Mazda6 better but once you get one setup with a few options it runs right up close to the sale prices on the G8 right now and that would be a tough option to pass up. Ironically my pay depends somewhat on car sales so if they aren't selling I can't be buying....

"jstandefer - you should check out some professional reviews of the 6 and take a look at the numerous international awards it has won since its inception. Are you telling me that it was not a massive improvement over the 626, which was selling fewer units than the Hyundai Sonata years ago? It was such a breath of fresh air for Mazda that Ford used its platform for the Fusion, Mercury Milan, and Lincoln MKZ."

I was very excited about the 6 when it first came out. In fact, I bought a 2003. It was a great improvement over the 626, although I did find that the 6 was dulled down a bit in the name of refinement (same goes for the Protege to 3 transition). I personally found the 6 to be a bit too soft and heavy for really enthusiastic driving... in fact I called a bloated understeering pig after a while. But the car that I came out of was a '99 Protege ES, which was significantly lighter and much more responsive, but had a very stiff ride (they softened the Protege and dulled its reflexes in the 2001 refresh). But I also found the 6 was too noisy, unrefined, and harsh to be mainstream. It was a car that couldn't decide what it was, the fuel mileage was disappointing (I had the lighter 4-cyl), and its back seat wasn't really much bigger than the Protege's. I wised up a year and half later and bought a Mazdaspeed Miata.

Ford did indeed use the 6 platform for the Fusion/Milan/MKZ, but they lengthened and widened it, which is why those three cars are larger than the first-generation Mazda6. Oh, while Ford was at it, they also siffened the chassis, allowing the Ford triplets to maintain the sporty tuning while softening the ride up a bit.

Mazda needs to advertise the increase in size and refinement of the 6 if they want to generate more sales. Consumers may still be equating it to the old 6. Just like when the '99 MPV came out and it was severely underpowered with the Duratec 2.5L V6 under the hood... Mazda significantly increased the power a few years later with the larger Duratec 3.0, but never pushed that fact, so it lingered on with its reputation of being underpowered. They need to change perception of the car, but as has been previously discussed here, Mazda's marketing is some of the worst in the industry. A good example is the Miata Power Retractable Hard Top... the quickest acting and least expensive retractable hard top on the market, and the only one that doesn't eat up any trunk space, all in a lightweight RWD roadster. Have you ever heard a Mazda commercial stating that? Have you ever seen Mazda even advertise the car? And then they wonder why sales numbers are not up to what they expected.

Re."Now it's kind of like everything is bloating up and out. First the Accord went, now the Mazda 6."

Indeed it does seem that way. Size is now a virtue. More is better. Fat is the new thin.

But it is worth noting that at least one manufacturer is bucking the bloatation trend. Nissan's Altima and Maxima are both smaller than the models they replace. Stands to reason, as they are about the only Asian import manufacturer (apart from Subaru) that are even attempting to inject an element of sportiness into their mainstream midsize sedan offerings.

@Jaeger1
I couldn't agree more. Nissan got everything right with its Altima and Maxima redesigns IMO- the interior improved, the handling AND ride improved, fuel economy improved, and performance improved. Makes me wonder why Mazda, Acura, Honda, Toyota, and even Volkswagen can't do the same.

"Nissan got everything right with the Altima and Maxima redesigns"

I agree that Nissan got it right with the Altima but not the current Maxima. When the redesigned Altima was introduced in 2002 it was the biggest and fastest car in its class. The larger size was one of the selling points over the smaller Accord and Camry. Notice that Honda and Toyota then copied Nissan's formula with their redesigns larger and faster. Nissan then did the same with the Maxima and it was a hit. I know several people who say the best thing about their Max is the interior room. Nissan then shrunk the Max to go back to the 4DSC theme from the 90's. Not working, where I live you rarely see a 2009 Max on the road and dealers are offering cash incentives on the Max. It is also hard to justify spending 35 to 40,000 on it when you can get a G37 for about the same price.

"I'm starting to think you're either slow or just stupid."

cx7lover - very mature. If you are right and I am wrong, why can't you just make your point without resorting to personal attacks?

Back to substance rather than name-calling...lots of consumers buy cars that I wouldn't, so frankly I don't care if the CX-7 out sold the 6. When the redesigned Camry and Accord launched, they sold plenty of them and they are everywhere. Many people wait until a re-design is available because they want the newest thing. This is one reason why very few re-designs come with incentives.

So, to cx7lover, neither the Mazda6 nor the CX-7 would be considered ubiquitous, IMHO. Point is, many cars sell well, but that doesn't mean they are the best cars for me...or even good cars at all. Some good cars, such as the G8, may not sell in mass numbers for lots of reasons. So what if the first Mazda6 didn't meet sales expectations? I don't buy something just because everyone else does; jump on the band wagon if you want.

After test driving the MZ6 the steering does suck and its the main reason I will not be upgrading my MZ3 with one.

I have a V6 '09 Mazda 6 (sSport trim).

While there is indeed a lack of feedback through the steering wheel, it's definitely not light. It leans towards the heavy side, which I prefer.

Not sure if Mazda made it heavier on the V6 models vs. the 4-cylinders, or if I just got lucky with the steering on mine.

Think. About. It.

Mazda made a new 6 to sell cars.

Obviously the Mazda faithful, while proud, were not enough to generate the sales numbers the company desired. Thus, they create a formidable foe to the nissans/toyotas/etc that have been stealing the buyers they wanted for how many years now. To me, it seems like Mazda doesn't really care about the old 6's avid followers, and I don't really blame them. They've bought their cars already, and not all of them come back. Instead, they focused attention to people like me, someone who hadn't owned a Mazda before. Someone looking for a sporty car, that was big enough to fit children or adults in the back seat comfortably. "zoom zoom to novacaine" give me a break. This car has plentiful portions of everything; technology, sport, styling, all while being a good daily commuter. Enthusiasts they marketed to never came in the numbers they desired, so they changed targets. People wanted bigger cars, cars with a little sophisticated technology, and a car with a sense of freshness. So that's what was made. Don't fault a company trying to survive, let alone make a profit.

And as for sales numbers, look at car sales as a whole. Think maybe now isn't the time to be making concrete conclusions from the data?

As far as more sales go, while you can't fault a car company for wanting to sell more cars; there's a bit more to it than that....

The current 6 is the car I was expecting the last one to be, when that one was first released. I was excited.... until I got to try one on for size at the NY Auto Show. Although far from being a fat bastard, I'm a big guy. And, I could barely fit behind the driver's seat of the last 6. (Even with the seat all the way back and adjusted). Forget about finding a comfortable position, I could barely fit in the car.

What a disappointment. The car seemed to be fitted for rail-thin crackheads. I don't normally take a chance on First Year models, but the new 6 is clearly made for those of us who are enthusiasts but can only afford one car.

(Yeah, I'd like to have a pure-breed sports car for weekend fun, and a fuel-effcient daily driver for work. But my bank account says that's not happening).

Instead of possibly alienating the Zoom-Zoom faithful, the new 6 is bringing the Mazda message to more converts. You can indeed have fun in a mid-size sedan without paying BMW prices.

I've been waiting for THIS 6 since before Mazda introduced the LAST 6 to the world.... And now I've got one. (Zoom-Zoom Baby).