2008 Smart Fortwo: Keeping the Pressure On

Quick qustion(s)

Isn't the smarts transmison an "automated manual?" Meaning that it has an actual clutch and not a fluid coupling.

So does this mean that the clutch is always partialy engaged, leading to the aformentioned creeping at lights? Does this lead to premature clutch wear? Or am i just being anal?

Good question redliner. I also would have thought that 0 mph + full brake + idle speed = complete clutch disengaement.

Plus, how bad are the Smart's brakes if a car that only makes ~70hp at the top of the rev range can cause stop light creep at idle?

i think the smart needs some brembos

redliner - the Smart is an automated manual, which may be the issue. A human would switch to neutral at a stop light - the Smart's computer seems to downshift to first and stay in gear, which is why it will creep if the brakes aren't engaged. I haven't noticed that it needs undo pressure, but I've only had mine a month.

It is possible that the car was rolling due to gravity. Otherwise I would say this automated manual= total fail. Well it already is anyway.

I couldn't possibly hate this car more but thanks to the communists in our state government this is all we'll be allowed to drive in a few years. I'm sure they'll be allowed to keep their cars for "security purposes" though.

Are we all reading the same blog? The author mentions that in a moment of inattention he let off the brake and the car rolled forward. Could happen to anyone, in all sorts of cars. Everyone's responding as if he wrote that at every light and stop sign, he has to sit there holding the brake with all his might, beads of sweat forming on his brow, rear wheels squealing and smoking as he struggles to contain 68 lb-ft of 3-cylinder fury.

It's a SMART. It weighs 1800 lbs and idling at a light it's making about 10 lb-ft of torque. If he'd actually rolled into the crosswalk, a little old lady would put up her hand to stop it rolling, scowl at the driver and say "Dude! I'm walking here!"

You guys will grasp at any feeble straw that feeds your dislike of this car.

When you're slowing to a stop, the transmission downshifts through the gears to provide engine braking and releases the clutch as you come to a stop to prevent stalling, but doesn't shift into neutral right away. If you remain stopped for a certain length of time with your foot on the brake (not just resting on the pedal) it will shift out of gear and you could take your foot off the brake without it rolling forward. The tradeoff is that you have to wait a moment after you hit the gas for it to shift back into gear and go.

It just seems odd that with the brake depressed, the clutch would still be engaged. Otherwise, it wouldn't creep forward at all. Wouldn't that be really hard on the clutch?

You can't have the clutch disengage every time you touch the brakes or the car would go out of gear every time you slowed down. The computer waits until you've been on the brakes a while, and because it's an adaptive ECU the wait time is probably different for everyone based on previous driving patterns. Which means the Smart at Edmunds is likely schizophrenic after a year of different drivers.

Is that hard on the clutch? Apparently not, if the lack of squawking about prematur clutch wear from owners here and in Europe is any guide.

feeble straws? the section under the photo it was done again while paying attention and it was still unusually difficult. were we reading the same blog?

epbrown

Grasping at straws?!

Allow me to explain why many of the readers here feel disdain for this "car."

Besides easy parking and chic factor, this cars got nothing.

Relatively poor fuel economy (on premium)
Underpowered
Transmission is slow
overpriced
Not comfortable (a by-product of the short wheel base)
Not practical, unless you have no friends, spouse, kids, or luggage
Not safe (yes, i know it has a magic safety cell, but it cant make up for the difference in weight. It may not crush, but physics cannot be changed. The energy from a crash has to go somewhere. instead of being dissipated in a "crumple" it goes into your body.

For similar money, a MINI (not to mention the Yaris, Fit, Versa, Aveo, and cobalt) delivers far better value while still maintaining a compact footprint.

I'm actually interested to drive a Fortwo. I should be the target customer for this car ( no kids, history of driving small european cars, live in a metro area, like unique things...) but I just can't get excited about them. Everyone I've talked to tells me they actually drive like crap. I pretty much universally hear the transmission sucks. They have so little mass you are at a distinct disadvantage in a collision with anything larger than a dog. The fuel economy is only marginally better than a Honda Fit, a car that is light years more practical and presumably more reliable long-term. They're slow and relatively noisy from what I understand. Like I said, I'd like to drive one to see for myself, but at this point I'm thinking the only people who would want one are attention seekers.

There's an old saying that due to prejudice a woman has to work twice as hard as a man to be seen as twice as good. This is how you guys come across about the Smart. It's slow (it's comparable to the Aveo and Yaris, same as a Fiat 500, faster than the original Prius and the new iQ). It has "relatively poor fuel economy" (despite getting better mileage than the Fit, Aveo, and Yaris). It's overpriced (a base Smart is about $7000 cheaper than a base Mini, $2500 less than a base Fit, half the price of a Jetta TDI or Prius).

It's cheap but it should be cheaper, it's mileage is good but it should be better, it scores good safety ratings but it should be invincible. The Smart's chief problem seems to be that it isn't something else. The Smart's chief failing seems to be prejudice becuse it's not a conventional 4-passenger hatchback with 4-cylinders and manual transmission.

Except that was kind of the whole point.

I bought my Smart last month after reading this entire blog because I realized that almost everything negative said about the Smart here comes from people with no direct experience with the car OR the competitors they recommend; in short, most of you seem to have no idea what you're talking about.

So my recommendation to someone considering a Smart should focus on the Edmunds staff postings, the few posts by people that actually own one, and ignore the rest. And, of course, do what seems unthinkable for many here - take one for a test drive. :)

Sorry, that first quote should be "Work twice as hard to be seen as HALF as good." I hate that you can't edit on this thing.

epbrown

Your simply trying to defend your purchase. Whatever.