2008 BMW 135i: Not Interested

Wow. Can't believe I just read that post. I must be dreaming...

i agree with subytrojan about the lights.

anyways, i got over the ugly thing because if it were to get scratched, dented, or simply dirty... i would not care.

for the money, you really don't get much more than the performance... and that is appealing in its own way. the super expensive options really make me not even think about clicking any of the boxes other than the sport package.

i've said it all along about the rear seats being worthless... and the ride and handling is still pretty good... not 3-series good, but not horrible.

This appeals to the driving enthusiast with a taste for speed, so much that the stock power levels are not adequate. Perfect for the EVO/ STI crowd at least. A few of my friends got the 335i and have already done the usual exhaust and ecu mods, but they have more money to spend than I do.

I'm still on the fence myself... I would rather have this than the EVO or STI, but would I rather have it or the 370Z? That I can only assume a test drive will settle...

interestingly enough, the pictures you provided for this post actually make 135 look very attractive and cool. There's nothing like buying a new car and I know for sure I won't get a 135 after I pay off my 325i. 128? Maybe. 370Z? More likely. WRX? I can't drive stick... =(

I really don't think its as ugly in real life as it is in pictures. But I also seem to have a better opinion about this car in general.

I found the 1-series interior to be a blend of exceedingly cheap and nicely appointed. I think they could've found a middle ground, like a VW Jetta.....nice, not typicaly BMW accoutrement but still well-appointed.

Suby - I have to disagree. The rear taillights are one of the 3 reasons I argue with myself over buying a CPO 2007 335i sedan 6-speed. The chrome moustache is one of the other two. I have seen nice body kits which seem to make it all work though....I just don't want to add a body kit to a BMW.

Suby - Side note....I drove a good friend's new (to him) 2007 WRX Wagon 5-speed....and fell back in love with Subaru. It has a magic my LGT is still missing.....I'm going to, probably, open source tune the LGT to get the power delivery of that Rex.

The look has grown on me. Actually saw my first 2 on the road last week. About 5 minutes apart a 135 and a 128.

At the risk of getting the worth it/not worth it argument going again. I was amazed when I went to the nearest BMW dealers site and all the ones they had were over $40,000 and they had a couple convertibles for $50,000. I know you can special order them with just what you want but this is definately not the poor mans BMW.

Bah. Don't quote Warren Clark out of context. Here was his conclusion:

"All in all, though, this is one fun ride. More, please."

http://blogs.edmunds.com/roadtests/2008/09/2008-bmw-135i-fast-times-and-run-flat-tires-.html

@jkp1187,

Calling a quote "out of context" implies that the views of the quote's author have been misrepresented. That's not the case here. Warren goes into considerably more detail, but what he wrote is certainly consistent with my statement that the 135i "doesn't ride great." Actually, I'd say Warren comes down even harder on the 135i's ride than I do.

For the record, I agree that the 135i is one fun ride. I don't think it's the best way for an enthusiast to spend $37 grand though.

-S.B. True

I agree that this thing is FUGLY. I also hated the 3 sedan and really liked the Coupe for it's much better looks.

Mr. Sadlier however is critical when it comes to interior materials and ride quality.

@SB True:

Fair enough, but Warren endorsed the 135i overall, whereas you were panning it. One could have walked away from your blog post with the perception that he, too, panned the 135i. I stand by my earlier post.

S.B True,

Why were you so impressed with the car in June 2008 and now have a change of heart? See the link:

http://blogs.edmunds.com/roadtests/2008/06/2008-bmw-135i-now-thats-a-lot-of-motor.html

You are the same person correct?

@boostdriven,

I don't see anything there that contradicts what's in today's post. Do you?

I don't really care what others think about the looks, they would not put me off from buying this car...they don't make me wanna buy it either, but I don't hold the looks against this car. Also I cannot attest to your suspension ride comfort/handling complaints...but I do agree with you on the interior part, at least in part. I think both the 1 AND 3-series interiors are sub-par for the class, with unattractive designs, subpar ergonomics, lack of space for taller people, and mediocre materials quality. The interior is far and away the biggest thing stopping me from being interested in owning any BMW on the market.

@clarkma5,

I'm curious as to why you find the 3 Series interior to have "mediocre materials quality." Having driven every car in the segment, the 3 Series' materials quality actually strikes me as the best (Audi is overrated here, IMO). Where do you think it falls short?

-Josh

Audi is overrated here, IMO

Now you're just bordering on insanity. The 3 series has nice materials but the design is bland, even more so than the A4. Not to mention they use some of the same coatings on the plastic. 330i door pocket Peeling? Forget about that? The A4 suffers the same fate on the headlamp switch, and the center armrest handle. They've done away with most of the prematurely aging plastic coatings on the B8 A4 which is good.

@cx7lover,

I was talking about materials quality, not design. You say the 3 has "nice materials" -- I agree. That's why I was surprised when clarkma5 opined that the materials quality was "mediocre."

A4 materials are also nice, but in my view the 3 Series materials are a smidge richer. They're certainly competitive, at any rate.

I've about decided to grit my teeth and keep my Mazdaspeed 3 for several more months- after which I'll start my search for a CPO 135i. I'm not all that concerned with the looks and as for the interior, I suspect it is much more durable than it appears. The interior styling and materials of my E36 3er were also critcized in contemporary road tests, but at thirteen years and 114000 miles it shows less wear than the Mazda's- which is two years old and has but 29000 miles on it. I figure I'll drop a few grand on a limited slip and either the Dinan or Turner re-flash and I'll have one terrific track rat. At my last HPDE one of the other instructors had a lightly modded 135i and it was one fast sled.

I actually don't mind its looks, colour/angle choice is important of course. I do agree with the stable/ride comment though. As a porsche & 330i owner (and serial owner of many other cars), when I first drove the 135i, I wanted one. The unique looks, the puppy dog personality and the power. After second and third drives though, that want mostly disappeared. It is not the pure sports car the porsche is, nor is it the competent 3er the 330i sport is. It's just not set up as well. It's fun but it doesn't feel as stable (nor as luxo or quiet for that matter, but we're not looking for that here). I felt a need for suspension upgrade and also the short wheelbase/high power makes it a bit ruffled as well.

Disagreed with most of that post. I can't say that I've ever driven a BMW so I wouldn't know about most of those points. But I don't see what all the fuss is about the looks. I really think it is a decent looking car. It is also really quick too. I do agree about the 328i statement though. If only the 330i was still sold here it would make a great car. And the new coupes (328 & 335) are absolutely gorgeous. I think there some of the best looking cars you can buy for the money.

328 is a great deal -especially right now. I've seen a few dealers promising 3k off invoice on remaining 1 series cars. Yeah that's not as good as 10k off M3s but it's nothing to sneeze at.

FWIW, i like the looks, find the suspension soft (but not Buicky soft like the 3) and interior materials are the same as the 3. Good enough for me.

@blueguy,

"interior materials are the same as the 3"

They're really not. Have you sat in 'em back to back? The 3's dash is covered with a pliable material that looks and feels rich -- it even extends down around the center stack (as in the A4, though not the C-Class Benz, if memory serves). The 1's is all hard stuff, with the exception of the cheesy paper-thin layer on the upper dash that I mentioned. One might argue that that's appropriate, given the 1's entry-level status, and I would agree. But no way are the materials the same; the 3 is clearly a class above.

Looks nicer, too, IMO. The 1 has that weird split in the middle where the top half of the dash goes off on a different plane. Then there's the missing chunk over on the right side next to the door. Not bad-looking overall (inside, that is), but not as cohesive/attractive as the 3's layout.

"Beauty is in the eye of the beholder" as the old saying goes. I think the 3er sedans are butt-ugly and the 3er coupe slightly better. From my point of view the 1er looks better. Many would disagree with me but I think the 1er's design is a more natural progression of BMW design of the E36/E46 than the current 3er's design. As far as having a harsh ride is concerned...well that is ticky-tacky to say the least. The ride is no where near bone-jarring and should be good enough for 90% of the people out there. As far as the "confidence" comment, I seem to hear this a lot from taller drivers. Maybe it is something with the physical and visual perception a taller person has due to their own body physics and line-o-sight. Myself being only 5' 8" didn't feel "less" confident in the 1er vs. my old E39.
The interior materials ARE a slight step down (still much better than a few cars in its price range...STI, EVO, 350z). The cowl that holds the instrument panel is my biggest gripe...it is plastic and feels cheap whereas on my E39 it was wrapped in the rubbery, leather feeling stuff that BMW likes to use. Anyway like I said it is all in the eye of the beholder and you will still be getting a top-notch vehicle overall. Comparing the car to a 328i is wrong though. The engine automatically takes the 328i out of the pic. in my opinion. So I guess to break it down based on your opinions:

A. 328i - If you want luxury, relatively robust engine, good suspension for regular AND spritied driving.

B. 135i - If you want less luxury, bad ride quality with great handling, an absolute killer engine.

"FWIW, i like the looks, find the suspension soft (but not Buicky soft like the 3) and interior materials are the same as the 3. Good enough for me."

Not true. When I first sampled the 1 series at the NY auto show I immediately noticed the plastics are rock hard. I am so glad someone had the guts to point this out since it is blasphemous to criticize any BMW. The 1 series interior is OK for a $25k car but nothing to brag about for a $37k car. I dont even think its that ugly but the size and interior dictate that it should be cheaper. Perhaps BMWs 40% sales decline last month suggests some potential owners agree.

"One might argue that that's appropriate, given the 1's entry-level status, and I would agree. "

Its hard to give a car with a price range of $30k-$50k a free pass on hard plastics because its supposedly "entry level". Maybe to the upper, upper middle class but to most people the 1 series is a pricey compact car.

As some Motor Trend editor wrote recently, is one rock band better than another just because they play louder?

Maybe I'm getting old, but the 328 is the one I'd want to live with every day. More comfortable, but not too big. Not to mention 135 only comes in a 2-door, and I, like the author, would prefer a sedan. But if you want to compare coupes, the 1 looks even worse in comparison.

Plenty powerful enough, great handling AND ride, and lots of fun with a manual transmission. (And better gas mileage. It IS going back up, give Barry and the Congress a few weeks to figure something out.)

Car and Driver mentioned the 135i lack of body control when negotiating their recent track event. They seemed surprised at the excessive "up and down" motion the suspension exhibited. This kind of agrees with what Sadlier wrote.

I don't know about this hard plastic talk in the 1-series. I really don't see much to criticize materials wise in this vehicle. You want to talk hard plastic? Have a look in the X3 - that is the car to criticize. The 1-series I have sat in were quite nice inside, with regards to both materials and fit. If there is any hard plastic, its certainly not a memorable item from within the cockpit.

"Have a look in the X3 - that is the car to criticize."

Yes, but the X3 is a truck. I use it to haul dogs, track tires, Christmas trees, etc. The interior materials are durable and look like new after a bit of cleaning.

Though my BMWCCA membership is on the line, I'll say it: I agree with Josh, through and through.

BMWs 40% sales decline has NOTHING to do with the 1er. Their predicted sales for the 1er were right on target however....

You just might be getting older(that isnt a snipe BTW...just hear me out), but the target audience is NOT looking for a Sedan and could and would fork over the cash for some coilovers or the BMW "performance" suspension to "fix" the supposed lack of body control (which usually only shows up on the track or under REALLY spirited driving and usually noticed by a person who drives extensively in this manner) BMW ends up making even more money this way. For the TARGET audience for this car it is on the money....

@dougtheeng: Knock on the cowl around the instrument panel on a 1er and you will immediately notice the hard plastic....I still think the interior is pretty nice but there ARE some hard plastics in there.....

"...the target audience is NOT looking for a Sedan and could and would fork over the cash for some coilovers or the BMW "performance" suspension to "fix" the supposed lack of body control."

Exactly, the instructor I mentioned had fitted coil-overs to his 1er. It was extremely fast through the corners.

considering how much some people seem love and love to hate this car, i think its a pretty desirable ride...

as for the comparison to the 3 series, the ride quality on the 3 is better because the suspension was designed (3 YEARS NOW) to use the runflat tires. as i recall upon first introduction of the bmw 3 series with runflats, many commented on how it was just a bit off...also that after the first year out, tweaks were made to the suspension and the problem died out ***

in my opinion it seems that bmw has missed the mark on the 1er and the m-sport set up reacts terribly (bouncy jittery floaty harsh) to the stiff sidewalls of runflat tires (not to mention 18 inch wheels dont give a lot of rubber in the first place).

"in my opinion it seems that bmw has missed the mark on the 1er and the m-sport set up reacts terribly (bouncy jittery floaty harsh) to the stiff sidewalls of runflat tires (not to mention 18 inch wheels dont give a lot of rubber in the first place)."

A few of the British magazines point that out as well, though the poor condition of many Brit roads may also be a factor.

One thing some people ignore about BMW suspensions....their sport-packaged cars will replace their run-flat tires in about 20k miles. Alot of owners go to non-run-flats.

So they need to tune a car that feels consistent with vastly different tires.

My bet is that they tuned it to ride acceptably with run-flats for 20k, and then ride really well with good non-runflats for the 40-80k after that (life of the struts).

Joe

People are praising the fit and finish of the 1 series interior but that wasnt the issue. All BMWs have good fit and finish. I dont care much about plastics but if we are all to agree that "hard = cheap plastics" the 1 has cheap plastics. Period. It doesnt affect the build quality of the interior or the look but the plastics are rock hard. Its a mediocre, bland inteior. Not shocking considering its the cheapest BMW in the stable. As with a Mustang you arent paying for premium materials, you are paying for performance and the engine.

I think someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed.

Josh, you are one negative dude! I own this car. This is a sports car in a coupe body with its own unique style. That's more than I can say for your ubiquitous 3 series. Take a look at some of the other reviews ... and then take another drive. You are missing out on the fun.

"hey're really not. Have you sat in 'em back to back? The 3's dash is covered with a pliable material that looks and feels rich"

I owned an e90 (ED car). There's nothing rich looking or feeling in the e90.

"But no way are the materials the same; the 3 is clearly a class above."

Spent 1 miserable year with an e90. Spent several hours in a 1 series. They're pretty much the same.

"but not as cohesive/attractive as the 3's layout"

There is something attractive in an e9x's interior? Missed that. The e46's dearly departed interior was leagues beyond both. Sorry, the e90 looks and feels just as bargain basement as the 1 series. No ergonomics in either one either. Egad, the e90/e86 are a nightmare - poor window switch placement, center console isn't pointed at the driver, I could go on forever...

@blueguy,

Do you at least concur with my observations above? Here's what I wrote:

"The 3's dash is covered with a pliable material that looks and feels rich -- it even extends down around the center stack...The 1's is all hard stuff, with the exception of the cheesy paper-thin layer on the upper dash that I mentioned."

Throw out the evaluative parts ("looks and feels rich," "cheesy") and just consider the descriptions. Do you concur?

I'm guessing you do, since you've been in both cars. So we must disagree in our judgments. In other words, you agree that the dash materials are as described, but disagree that one is nicer than the other.

Fair enough, I suppose. However, automakers do generally use soft-touch (or stitched) dash materials to differentiate their more luxurious offerings from the hard-plasticked lower-end models. I guess you just don't share their/my values in this regard.

I took a 128i with the sport package (read: low profile summer tires and stiffer setup as in the 135 pictured herein) on a 3 plus hour trip (over 6 hours in one day travelling rural highways)recently and found it to be uncomfortable after about an hour or so. Don't get me wrong, it handles like a go kart around town and would be a fun little short distance commuter. The car is just too stiff and a bit cramped for my 6 foot frame for long hauls. Sadly, I only saw 24.3mpg over the entire 426 miles (did I mention that these were largely highway miles?) so if you are looking for an economical commuter then this isn't it. Lastly, it already has the stigma of being a chick car. Oh, well.

Long story short? It's the least expensive Bimmer you can currently get. Six grand or so less expensive than a comparable 3 series. If you simply are looking to spend around $35K and just gotta have the blue and white Bavarian colors flying on the hood opt for a 1-2 year old Certified Pre-owned 3 series.

BTW what IS the best way to spend 37k? With a back seat and BMW-grade reputation/quality (subjective I know...)?

"If you simply are looking to spend around $35K and just gotta have the blue and white Bavarian colors flying on the hood opt for a 1-2 year old Certified Pre-owned 3 series."

Agreed.

"BTW what IS the best way to spend 37k?"

But a $20k MINI and put the rest on you mortgage.

To each his own. IMO, the review is just off the mark as reviewing through the eyes of a true enthusiast. I've owned 4 BMWs to date, E30 325ix, E36 M3, E46 330xi and now E82 135i. The 135 coupe is the closest thing to pure BMW that BMW has made since the 1980s. Newer 3ers (coupe aside) are downright ugly and deviate from BMW styling cues down to the unlit tail lights. 3-series has simply grown too large. As for the ride comfort, better than the E36 M3 and on par with an E90 330i on 18s. Spend some time sans run-flats, world of a difference. Stability concerns? It's more nimble at speed than the E46, and added weight renders it more sure footed than the E36 M3. Hot, cold, rain or snow, speak with owners, the car's balance and stability are superb. Styling: that's all a matter of opinion, but the 1-series is the closest thing to classical BMW styling in the current lineup. Take a look at the silhouette, proportions and greenhouse are reminiscent of E30 and 2002. I support complaints of interior fit and finish 100%, it fails to meet BMW standards which could use some work on their own.

So before you slam it, take a step back; take a look at BMW heritage, assess the current 'growing' lineup, and open your eyes to the gap the 3er has left behind. It's not perfect, but the 1er fills that gap appropriately. What are your needs and what do you expect from the car. It's not the tourer like the 3er, but I've done multiple 5-6 hour trips, averaging 30 MPG, in complete comfort.

SadButTrue,

I really don't see the gulf you guys are finding. Then again, when I'm driving I'm touching the steering wheel, shifter, armrest and buttons. What the dash feels like (or looks like) doesn't matter to me. Door panels aren't important. Plastics used for the center console...I rarely touch.

On my drive in this morning I touched the alloy door handle on my Cooper S, chrome door release, the steering wheel, shifter, cheap turn signal and flimsy button for the seat heater. That's pretty much the way it goes daily with occasional forays to the radio or window/hvac controls. I couldn't tell you if my dash is soft-touch or what the plastic feels like below my e-brake. I'm not feeling up the car all day. To me and what I touch, the e87 and e90 feel the same inside (with the 1 feeling a big more cockpit like and less Buicky spacially).

I owned an e46 for 3 years and I seriously can't recall ever touching the upper dash above BMW's ridiculous HVAC dotted wheel.

@zoomzoomn and adrean8j,

"If you simply are looking to spend around $35K and just gotta have the blue and white Bavarian colors flying on the hood opt for a 1-2 year old Certified Pre-owned 3 series."

"BTW what IS the best way to spend 37k? With a back seat and BMW-grade reputation/quality"

That's where the 328i comes in. Add the Sport Package, don't add anything else, and you've got an MSRP of $36,275 with destination. Done.

Of course, if it were my $35k, I'd grab the lowest-mileage '04-06 M3 I could find and slap some kind of extended warranty on it. But you all knew that already.

-Josh

328 is a decent car but for power junkies, it's decidedly limp.

Right now 2008 328is can be had for about $1200 below invoice.

Come on!! Don't you all feel up on your dashes everyday? I know it really matters so much because you're always coming in contact to it.
pfft

"328 is a decent car but for power junkies, it's decidedly limp."

Agreed, although I think that a 128i with a little re-mapping would be a fun ride. Still, one equipped my way-SP, CWP, USB port-is still @$35000- and at that point an E46 M3 looks REALLY good.

""BTW what IS the best way to spend 37k?"

Buy a $20k MINI and put the rest on your mortgage."

Smartest thing I've read yet.

If that occurred to more people, the finicial crisis would never have happened.

"If that occurred to more people, the finicial crisis would never have happened."

Hahahahahaha. Actually it would be severely worse..

cx7, people paying off their mortgages would make the situation worse? Interesting...people paying bills hurts the economy?

"Then again, when I'm driving I'm touching the steering wheel, shifter, armrest and buttons. What the dash feels like (or looks like) doesn't matter to me. Door panels aren't important. Plastics used for the center console...I rarely touch. "

Didnt you get the memo? Interior plastics are what its all about these days. I agree with your assessment but in recent years the auto media has focused more on plastics than vehicle costs, value, reliability, ride quality or anything else. IN fact, its even more important than fuel economy. When you read reviews of most current domestic vehicles the negativity is mostly related to softness of interior plastics and vinyls. Apparently that is enough to make a car not worth buying. Unless its a 135 or EVO of course.

cx7, people paying off their mortgages would make the situation worse? Interesting...people paying bills hurts the economy?

People buying just Mini's? The economy would crumble and Mini wouldn't even be able to survive. Not everyone has the stability to sustain a mortgage, let alone a variable rate one, which is why we're in this state now.

When the CTS Coupe comes out, it'll make the 135, and 328, look like the rip-off's that they really are. Don't get me wrong, they're nice cars, but not worth their asking price. They're about $10k too high, IMO.

In the meantime, I would take the G37 Coupe. Better looking inside and out, more power, and offers 95% of the handling and ride of the 135. Fewer compromises, more luxury and features, same price.

My friend picked up one of these and is beaming with pride.

The engine sounds ok, but it's "meh." Sounds like your average V6 with someone making "whoosh" noises. GM's 6.0L V8, Nissan's VQ, or even a Honda four all offer a far more enticing sound. Yeah, I know BMW I6's are supposed to be the best, but this is no M3. It's thrust is... well, good, but matched by cars that cost 30% less- cars that handle better, are assembled better, and are far more composed. All in all I felt about as much passion for this engine as I did a Camry's, though the Camry's will probably last about 3 times as long.

The interior is trash. Cheap flinty plastics mixed with good quality leather- but it just doesn't cut it. The design, assembly, and material quality are above Chrysler, but definitely sub-Infiniti (that's right, I said sub-infiniti!)

The exterior is also ugly, both in proportions and cut lines.

I'm left with the overall impression that this is just $45,000.00 worth of shoddy engineering. Of course, that's what BMW's been about for the past what... 7 years?

@mikeolan,

"shoddy engineering" -- Obviously untrue. BMW's twin-turbocharged six is one of the best-performing engines on the market (though "no M3," of course), and *in general* BMW suspensions strike the best ride/handling balance in the business (not the case with the 135i, as noted). I would put BMW's engineers up there with the best (and, crucially, least fettered by budgetary constraints) in the business.

"'whoosh' noises" -- Has your friend's car been modified? I can't hear any turbo whoosh in our 135i. Also, it sounds a whole lot better than a Honda four (unless you're thinking of the 2.0-liter S2000 engine, maybe, or an old Integra GSR/Type-R motor) or Nissan's VQ (coarse at higher rpm).

"matched by cars that cost 30% less - cars that handle better, are assembled better, and are far more composed" -- No such car.

"design, assembly and material quality are above Chrysler, but definitely sub-Infiniti..." -- Design is debatable; material quality, yes, I agree. But assembly? Come on. The 135i is certainly screwed together tightly. BMW build quality is currently quite high.

"for the past what... 7 years," BMW has been making some of the finest cars in the world.

Sheesh.

-Josh

@SadButTrue:

"That's where the 328i comes in. Add the Sport Package, don't add anything else, and you've got an MSRP of $36,275 with destination. Done.

Of course, if it were my $35k, I'd grab the lowest-mileage '04-06 M3 I could find and slap some kind of extended warranty on it. But you all knew that already."

Yes you can get a 328i for that much...but not the coupe (target audience for the 1er remember?). You can get a 135i without any extraneous options for around that much. The bigger engine is the draw here for the "target audience".

Trust me I really, really thought about the E46 M3...it really, really gave me nightmares when choosing to buy....I ended up choosing the 1er because of:

A. Newer (My first EVER new car..and I am 34)
B. N54 (mainly the FI aspect of it)
C. Cost of maintenance for the next 4-6years
D. Exclusivity (did I spell that right?), although the M3 is pretty exclusive as well.

Good Thread BTW...I love hearing a intelligent, reasons behind some of the dislikes regarding the 1er. (Still love mine though)

@mikeolan

it is difficult to find anything in your post that holds value.

you compare the attraction of the twin turbo inline 6 to a camry's powerplant. Nothing to say here, thats just foolish...

you claim BMW has been under-engineering their cars for 7 years.
the E46 m3 brought out 7 years ago is out performed by the new 335. the millions of other examples do not need to be stated here.

name one new car that is assembled better, handles better, is more composed (a relative evaluation btw) for THE SAME PRICE...now lets take away 30% and try again...

@Sadbuttrue / Aris4

Nissan 370Z.

There's even an Edmunds video on Youtube right now sharing my consensus, however a quick drive in both will nail it shut. Next to the Z, the 135i is sloppily assembled, offers neither a composed ride or exceptional handling, and offers practically the same thrust. Oh, but at least the 135i has its share of awkward panel gaps you can stare at!

Of course, unlike BMW, Nissan spent its R&D on building sophisticated sports cars instead of... iDrive.

"Of course, if it were my $35k, I'd grab the lowest-mileage '04-06 M3 I could find and slap some kind of extended warranty on it. But you all knew that already."

My sentiments exactly. I was wondering how long it would take for you to say that.

mikeolan -- I like the 370z, but my sons, nieces and nephews would probably be very angry with me that they couldn't all share the experience of a thrill ride down a twisty road in a 370Z as they all do in my 5-seat Bimmer. It's probably a lock that at least three of them will be driving Bimmers in the future; manuals with sport package, just as the Lord intended. And really, all that hyperbole in your original post was way over-the-top. What, did you go to writing class with Michael Jordan?

@Sgude: Unless they're masochists, I can assure you that nobody shares any such 'thrill' riding in the back of the 135i.

I'm not spitting hyperbole- the 135i is a cheap, junky car in just about every single dynamic. Looking beyond the numbers, this is a miserable piece of engineering and the fact that anyone would defend it makes me question their actual ownership of a driver's license, let alone time behind the wheel.

@Mikeoloan:

You are crazy when it comes to the back seat thing...For those of use with elementary age children or NO children it also becomes a moot point. If you look at some of my recent posts above you will note I mentioned BMW's TARGET AUDIENCE....that audience has no need of a back seat for adults on long trips. The seat is functional enough for a quick trip to the local restaurant or mall. It is large enough to fit my 9 year old son.

You ARE spitting hyperbole...and quite well I might add. Cheap, junky car? With Brembo 6-piston/4-piston brakes? With great leather? Great Steering wheel? Some of the nicest BMW stock wheels to date? The plastics inside the baby-bimmer are not CHEAP....they are, however, cheaper than what was used in previous E46's. Go sit in a Fiat Punto...or an Opel Astra/Vectra/Omega....THAT is cheap...Miserable engineering? Because they use cheaper plastic? Because they didn't put an M3's suspension in it? Because it has runflats? Come on Mike! Response?

wow, so many BMW haters on here. maybe after we get out of this recession more of the critics will be able to actually afford one, rather than basing judgment on a ride in their (imaginary) friend's 10 year old Bimmer.

I forget who mentioned either of these but the CTS coupe is butt ugly. I liked the sedan, almost got one, but I don't need the big rear seat and while it performed better than most American cars, it performed worse than most foreign cars.

Love the 370Z, more than even the CTS, I personally consider Nissan the BMW of Japan. However, I still think a BMW offers more refinement, better engineering, (definitely) less road noise and better ride quality, especially if you were to take the shitty run flats off, and of course, free maintenance.

Interior quality on BMW I agree could be improved. The dash isn't great to look at, but the ultra-comfortable leather sports seats are almost unmatched for the car price.

"Come on Mike! Response?"

His mother made him go to bed; he has to walk his paper route in the morning.

OK @mikeolan, I'm taking the bait: you're an idiot.

PDXLager;
I hope you realize that you have insulted idiots worldwide...;)

@ adrean8j Well, if an $18,000.00 car (costing far less than half as much) makes the BMW 135i feel expensive, great! Good to know you/BMW is using such an excellent bench mark. But compare it to a car costing a similar amount (Not made by Mitsubishi or Subaru...) , and Whoa! Sat in a 370z? How about a G37, or even a 3 series?

But let's talk about the suspension- one offering neither excellent handling prowess, poise, or compliance. At one time BMW meant buying the holy trifecta of these three characteristics. Sure the 135i handles pretty well, but the suspension isn't well sorted. That's more indicative of 'miserable' engineering, the sloppy interior (Nice leather, sure, but crummy seats, crummy fit, crummy finish) is just icing on the cake.

But hey, at least it has those nice wheels! They look great next to those crude panel gaps!