2002 BMW M3: Track Testing the Sumitomo HTR ZIII

I'd say so, all your acceleration test were better or equal to the advan's and only slightly longer in the breaking test. plus you saved $548. Sure you give up a little but not so much as to spend the extra cash for a street car.

I also am wondering how many miles you have on the tires before testing them. It takes at least 500 miles for the mold release to burn off and give you proper grip. But your findings are similar to what I've read - they are not great at tolerating a lot of heat and can get a little greasy feeling. So maybe they are great street and auto-x tires, but not the best for the track. The full tread depth can add to the heat build-up too though.

It really depends on how they end up wearing, in my opinion. $132 won't be a bargain if they're out in a fraction of the time!

Yes, you can go through 2 sets of the cheap-o stuff and still be saving money over 1 set of the pricey tires.

total waste of money. the only cheap tires i buy perform just as well or better than many expensive ones in the dry, but not so great in the wet. given that we live in so cal and drive performance cars, it seems to be an acceptable compromise.

i just laugh when people throw junk tires on their sports car or "race car" because it kills the performance so much... granted these tires are probably not the worse you can get, but you can see how different the car performs. those numbers are HUGE!

How does the ride quality and noise level compare with the Yokos? The Sumitomos might have a less aggressive compound that fares better on the street than on the track.

These numbers might matter if this M3 was getting tracked everyday, but it isn't so it doesn't and the savings are worth it.

We don't yet know if the tires were broken in (yes, 500 miles is the standard for wearing off molding lubricants but I'd say 1000 is truly broken in) or if the tire pressures have been dialed-in.

Also, good comments re: noise and comfort.

Joe

"We don't yet know if the tires were broken in (yes, 500 miles is the standard for wearing off molding lubricants but I'd say 1000 is truly broken in) or if the tire pressures have been dialed-in."

We make sure to break in tires, brakes and entire vehicles before testing. This was no different. Tire pressures are checked and adjusted during the pre-flight check in period at the track.
-mike

Thing is for there to be a proper comparison the different sets of tyres needed to be tested on the same day. Differences in track surface, temps etc etc will effect results.
Basically you'll need a second set of the same rims with the different tyres, and someone who can change out the rims in a hurry.

+1, desmolicious

Wow, those are some pretty noticeable drops in braking, slalom and g's. I guess they'd be fine on the street if they're ok on wet. And they'd likely be fine for most cars. It's just that for an m3 or similar vehicle, you really do need the best available.

Good to know, I think I was one of the commenters hoping for such a test i.e either these sumi's or the new goodyear f1 asymmetric. Thanks for following up.

The savings are for sure worth it for every day and minimal track/canyon use. If you are really going to be using the car for a lot of track use though, the Advans are worth it.

Mike. Have you guys had Inspection II done (specifically, the valve adjustment)? There was some speculation about this when you did the 135/335/E46 M3 comparo, because the acceleration numbers seemed a little high. I know you probably don't want to be launching like it was new, but 5.3 is slower than most reviews I remember reading.

Tenfifteen,
The slower acceleration is due to the weight of those big brakes...
:-p

While the Yoks are fine in a place like California that doesn't get much rain, the Sumitomos are probably better for the rest of us. I think the Sumitomos performed admirably considering the Yoks are about the stickiest street tire around. That's why they've won many Street Touring SCCA autocross championships. The AD07 is just short of an R-compound. I bet the Sumitomos last quite a bit longer than the Yoks and that is a HUGE price difference. Certainly nothing to ignore.

tenfifteen, good point. I remember the indy shop that Edmunds went to for Inspection II did everything EXCEPT for the valve adjustment. They were supposed to go back for it but I'm not sure if it ever got performed. That is the most expensive and important part of the Insp. II.

Those are some pretty significant differences, IMO. You get what you pay for here. Certain items in your life you shouldn't go cheap on. Tires, underwear, shoes, etc. Especially with a car like the M3.

If your budget is tight, look to save money elsewhere. Not on your tires.

Just want to point out though how really difficult it is to assess the differences in performance between two new cars, simply based upon tire equipment.

If one car has a .85 skidpad and a 68 mph slalom and the other a .9 skidpad and 70 mph slalom, do we say the latter is the better handler? Or is it simply a matter of better tires?

Think about all the tests out there claiming victors and losers, where the differences were far less than this M3 gained/lost due to tires and different days of testing.

Kinda puts in perspective why subjective feel is so important.

Joe

@m_thrizzle... I didn't know that. Unreal.

Mike/Edmunds... you *must* get the valve adjustment done. Not trying to be a scold, but this is absolutely the most important part, and VANOS being the fussy girl it is, not doing the adjustment every 25k will absolutely rob you of performance in the engine's sweet spot (north of 5k).

It's actually DIY-able if you are moderately capable with a wrench. I can point you to a link if you like.

It ain't about the numbers, its about the feel. There's no way the Sumos feel as good as the Yokes. YGWYPF.

Those numbers with the Sumos are lousy. Not worth the savings IMO. Why buy an M3 with all that capability and cheap out on the most critical component of that performance?

"YGWYPF"

+1!

Why buy a tire with all of that performance, and never have it see the light of day on a los angeles street?

^ Huh? Please explain, that statement doesn't make sense to me.

Should have gone with the Falkens.

m_thriz, I believe CX7 is saying the tire is overkill for the streets, as you won't ever be able to take the tire to its limits on the street.

I disagree with using that as a reason to buy shoddy tires on a performance car, just explaining what I think he meant.

Yeah, next time buy the Michelins.

Wow, just wow. There seem to be a lot of people on this thread that have mistaken these Sumitomos for a shoddy retread likely to cause a blowout at average freeway speeds. Reread the test results, please. There's less than 5% difference in performance between these tires for a 150% difference in price. Granted, safety and performance come at a cost, but how many here have a car that even matches the numbers put down by the Sumis?

I made some calculation errors - the actual difference in price is 96% (I had been thinking of the PS2s in 19" 245/275 sizes originally), but considering that the Sumis should last twice as long as either the Advans or PS2s, this number goes up to 192%. To put it in dollar terms, that's $274 for every .01g improvement on the skidpad and $435 for every 1mph improvement through the slalom. You would need to have a Big 3 style golden parachute to think that's a good deal in this economy.

I put a set of Sumitomo HTR ZIII's on my 2006 IS350 (installed at the Tirerack facility no less). The performance is not quite up to the best tires available, as evidenced by the numbers here, but it's darn close, and 95% of the performance for 50% of the price is a good deal. I've only had them for 3,000 miles so I can't speak to the longevity, but I'm enjoying them and they don't freeze solid like the Potenza RE050 stock tires when it's cold.