2008 Audi R8: Doesn't Like the "Cold" Either

You've got to love a "high performance" engine that can't perform in all conditions. Add the six cylinder M3 to the list of high performance cars that can't run in the cold. This wouldn't be tolerated on the Focus but it's okay for an $120k car? Go figure...

Michigan Tags?

Almost any high-performance engine will do this. The entire engine is optimized to run "hot," so cold temperature smoothness is compromised. But the computer controls will make sure it starts, and modern aluminum block engines heat up very quickly.

I like it!

Chavis10 -

Seriously??? You think 30 seconds of loud idle equates to not being able to run in the cold?

And you think this or any other high output engine is even remotely comparable to a Focus?

Remember - brain first, keyboard second.

btw - sounded pretty cool to me... i'm guessing the flaps in the mufflers are open during the short warm up period?

high performance engines are like that, it just shows how serious oe's are getting about performance. you ever seen or hear race cars start up in the morning?

zcalvert- Seriously? Have you ever heard of sarcasm? A small block doesn't stutter when, sounds just as good as produces just as much power. These issues are present only in highly stressed small displacement engines with super tight tolerances that can't handle cold temperatures. Give me a 6.2L LS3 that has none of these issues and much more torque, thanx.

It's curious to me how more excuses are made the more expensive the car. New cars should NOT have stuttering engines under any circumstances, period. 41 degrees is not even cold by the way... we've had days in the teens and 20s here so I'd hate to see how it'd handle those mornings.

You guys should start your M3 out when it's chilly... you'll get a similar stutter from the S54. Fairly normal; the car just runs a little rich at start up, settles down after 20-30 seconds. No biggie, and it was no worse for me when we were in the teens last week.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdMxQiM8ZoQ&NR=1

For comparison, a 6.2L LS3 starting up. (Happens at about 25 second mark.)

adavis2493
It's a loaner, remember?

did the ZR1 just fart?

"For comparison, a 6.2L LS3 starting up. (Happens at about 25 second mark.)"

Nothing against the Vette ZR1 but I didnt think it was ever going to even start.

I actually saw my first R8 (black/carbon sideblades) here in Ky this past weekend. Its one of the very rare cars that can literally stop me in my tracks. The car is a bit smaller than I expected although thats not a bad thing. Simply gorgeous!

Subaru uses an air pump to force extra air into its catalysts to help "light them off" when starting.
Does Audi do this?

"It's curious to me how more excuses are made the more expensive the car. New cars should NOT have stuttering engines under any circumstances, period. 41 degrees is not even cold by the way... we've had days in the teens and 20s here so I'd hate to see how it'd handle those mornings."

Well then I guess that ZR1 in the YouTube video with the extremely long crank and rough start should not have happened under any circumstance either.

And speaking of excuses for expensive cars, what's the excuse then for the $120K ZR1's laughably inadequate interior, including its Cobalt steering wheel and incredibly cheap seats? Stuff that's out of place on a $50K car much less a $100K+ one.

>>"For comparison, a 6.2L LS3 starting up. (Happens at about 25 second mark.)"

Nothing against the Vette ZR1 but I didnt think it was ever going to even start.
>>

Ditto!

"$120K ZR1's laughably inadequate interior, including its Cobalt steering wheel and incredibly cheap seats?"

Inadequate interior? At least I can function everything without playing with some metal mouseball. I'm sorry, I don't tend to erotically caress the interiors of my car, I like them to function intuitively without RTFM. Could the interior of the Vette be improved? Yes however in terms of function, it's superior to every BMW interior currently available, period. On top of that it's performance is marvelous.

PS- the seats have to do with some stupid crash worthiness issue specific to the C6 which does not allow for optional sport seats- it sucks but the car still destroys everything elese on the road so, if I have to make a concession to get the best sports car available, so be it. I'll take the Vette's seats over iDrive so, call it even.

I can't view the YouTube video at work but I will check it when I get home. Unlike you people, I don't make excuses for cars I like. So if in fact the ZR1 in video had a rough start, it should be corrected and I will call this a flaw. however, I haven't heard of this issue with other LS series engines so perhaps it is specific to the LS9 which has many different parts compared to the regular n/a LS3.

edubya- if it's a ZR1 in the video, it's the LS9, not the LS3.

The LS6 in my '02 Z06 doesn't mind the cold weather at all. Always starts right up, runs smooth, and doesn't smoke, even down to 10F (coldest I've driven it). It occassionally rifles out a loud POP or backfire during cold start which scares the hell out of women and small children, but I like it. Most LS series V-8s do that on cold start.

bimmerjay - I would hardly call the ZR1's interior "laughable", and the ZR1 costs $105k, not $120k. OK, the steering wheel is laughable, but that's about it. And I think when a performance car dominates and conquers all others, including cars costing 5 times more, you can cut it a little slack on the interior. Besides, people will be crapping their pants in this car on a regular basis - don't want to mess up a super high end interior with that.

"I don't tend to erotically caress the interiors of my car"

Ahh yes...The classic come-back of every sub-par interior comment. Right. You don't care, so it doesn't matter.

"Ahh yes...The classic come-back of every sub-par interior comment. Right. You don't care, so it doesn't matter."

Personally, I don't take offense to the Corvette's interior so, no it doesn't matter. The interior functions as one should and is very ergonmic so, what's really to complain about? I actually perfer the Vette's interior to any BMW or Porcshe interior with the latter being simply ridiculous. The '09s seem to be improved but I'll still pass. You rub your interior materials while I'll easily change radio stations and use the trip computer and nav system in a fraction of the time and effort it requires in other "superior" cockpit. Your "subpar" doesn't equal mine, so...

The Gallardo uses a last generation A4 interface for Nav, one of the worst systems available next to some current COMAND systems lingering around in vehicles such as the E, M, GL, and RL class MBs. To me, a $245k car with that system would be labeled inadequate. Again, you people will rather molest the center console than use logical systems in your vehicle. I'll never be in that side of a fence.

"Again, you people will rather molest the center console than use logical systems in your vehicle. I'll never be in that side of a fence."

What do you mean by "you people?" People who prefer quality? Try finding a Corvette review that doesn't bash the interior. I'll bet even Motor Trend makes mention of it. I'm not saying it's a bad car, but it's not a car you buy want a quality feel. Anyway, it's not like I'll change your mind. I'm sure that if the C7 has a nice interior, it'll suddenly become a selling point for the hordes of 'vette fans who had previously made comments like "I don't grope my dash."

By the way, it was clever of you to compare the worst of Europe to the best of GM. BMW and Porsche are constantly blasted for i-Drive and tiny-button-syndrome respectively. You also pointed out cars that use the old version of the COMAND system, but conveniently left out that the new version in the C-class "sets a new standard in the class" according to IL. You don't happen to work for GM's marketing department do you?

"And speaking of excuses for expensive cars, what's the excuse then for the $120K ZR1's laughably inadequate interior, including its Cobalt steering wheel and incredibly cheap seats? Stuff that's out of place on a $50K car much less a $100K+ one."

When you look at the vette's interior vs base model Porshe's, the Viper, the GTR, etc. I fail too see how its so terrible. The best interiors are NOT found on sports cars for the most part. Sports car interiors tend to be simple and driver oriented. If you want lots of suede and stitching you should get a Bentley or Aston Martin. It is not lined with animal hides but few cars under $200k are these days. The seats could be better but if thats the only serious flaw on the car I would say the car is pretty damn good.

"What do you mean by "you people?" People who prefer quality?

Please provide empirical data that quantifies the term "quality." You can't. If the interior is functional, aesthetically pleasing and doesn't fall apart, I would call that quality. The C6 meets those standards. I've sat in a few and found it a nice place to spend time as far as I'm concerned.

"Try finding a Corvette review that doesn't bash the interior. I'll bet even Motor Trend makes mention of it. I'm not saying it's a bad car, but it's not a car you buy want a quality feel. Anyway, it's not like I'll change your mind. I'm sure that if the C7 has a nice interior, it'll suddenly become a selling point for the hordes of 'vette fans who had previously made comments like 'I don't grope my dash.'"

Well obviously they grip about the interior- that's no secret. Here's the difference between me and "you people," I use the magazines to provide information I cannot myself produce. I cannot conduct performance testing but I can sit in vehicles and record my own observations. The C6 interior is much improved over the C5 in my opinion and I would have no reservations or regrets paying the asking price for it. To me, a current Porsche interior is unexcuseable for the price they are requesting. Are the materials nicer than the Vette's? Hell yes. However, the functionality is terribly worse so, pick your poison. I'd rather have one that's easy to use if I had to chose.

"By the way, it was clever of you to compare the worst of Europe to the best of GM. BMW and Porsche are constantly blasted for i-Drive and tiny-button-syndrome respectively. You also pointed out cars that use the old version of the COMAND system, but conveniently left out that the new version in the C-class 'sets a new standard in the class' according to IL."

The C class has a nice set-up no arguing there but it's not better than the system in the CTS or G35/37. It's better than the 3 series though and I haven't had to chance to play with MMI in the A4 (which is probably overcomplicated judging from what I've seen thus far). The system in the S class is nice and I've had a chance to play with it though I still rather have actual buttons/touchscreen than a jog wheel.

I don't take IL's opinions as gospel as they can't even properly edit their road tests. I email them almost biweekly to correct common mistakes so just because their day job is to write about cars does not make them experts.

"You don't happen to work for GM's marketing department do you?"

If I did, I'd be laid off right now, wouldn't I? As far as I know, GM doesn't have a marketing department in Philadelphia much to my chagrin. Darn...

sabastian,

If possible try to use shred of common sense. It doesnt matter if COMMAND is improved. Same with idrive or MMI. If you have a driver's car you want minimal distractions. Even the best ever version of COMMAND is more complicated than a car without such a system. When you have a car with explosive power like the vette you need not be fiddling with mice in the center console trying to turn on your heated seats or change the radio station. Such system are an answer to questions nobody asked but you give them a free pass because they are European.

"Try finding a Corvette review that doesn't bash the interior. I'll bet even Motor Trend makes mention of it. I'm not saying it's a bad car, but it's not a car you buy want a quality feel. Anyway, it's not like I'll change your mind. I'm sure that if the C7 has a nice interior, it'll suddenly become a selling point for the hordes of 'vette fans who had previously made comments like "I don't grope my dash."

The Vette's mission is to go fast, stop quickly and tackle curves with authority. As our President would say "mission accomplished". Its not a European sports tourer with a $150k price tag made by hand in some antiquated Italian factory. The mission of the car is not to have first rate animal hides and luxurious plastic surfaces. The interior LOOKS fine and is fully functional. Its amazing that Detroit hating badge snobs have forgotten what an interior is supposed to do. Its supposed to function well and provide the controls and information the driver needs in a logical manner. Material quality is subjective to a certain degree as if interior design. Personally I think the designs of most high end sports cars is lacking. I think Ferrari interiors look terrible. If the vette has a better interior next time I will be happy so whiners like you and Bimmerjay will run our of excuses. A better interior will not enhance the Vette's performance or value proposition and it will not pursuade any Porsche lovers to buy the vette. When you consider that I dont even know why people are so focused on the car needing an interior revamp. Its not going to entice anyone who thinks they are too good to drive a Chevy.

I saw the video and the car made one noise when the engine cranked. Dont know what it was but judging by the background scenery they were not in a cold weather state so the sound appears to be normal. I watched another video on there and a blue ZR1 made a similar blurb when started. The sound is wierd but if its not related to exterior conditions it must be normal for that engine.

"Ahh yes...The classic come-back of every sub-par interior comment. Right. You don't care, so it doesn't matter."

Acutally I think its more a matter of "whose to say how quality is defined" than anything else. You mention the automotive press but they praise the Vette's value more than they harp on the interior. The vette's interior is a function of its sub $50k starting price and it has been upgraded in recent years. If the vette had a Porsche grade interior and cost as much as a Porsche is wouldnt be a corvette. The value is part of the allure. As chavis stated the interior may be lacking in opulence but its perfectly functional and mildly attractive.

"by stingray,

bimmerjay - I would hardly call the ZR1's interior "laughable", and the ZR1 costs $105k, not $120k. OK, the steering wheel is laughable, but that's about it. And I think when a performance car dominates and conquers all others, including cars costing 5 times more, you can cut it a little slack on the interior. Besides, people will be crapping their pants in this car on a regular basis - don't want to mess up a super high end interior with that."

I think the problem that people have with the ZR1 is that the interior is the same as the base Vette and the ZR1 costs almost three times more. People expect something a little more than magnetic ride, Ferrari brakes and a "new" engine for a 100k car. GM could have given the interior a brush up. Yes, the performance is phenomenal but again a 100k car with what interior?! (The other cars like Ferraris and Lamborghinis are overpriced for what they are in my opinion). BUT, the fact remains that people who buy these cars don't have performance only in mind. If that were the case, a millionaire would buy a STI and modify it and run it against Ferraris, Lamborghinis wouldn't sell at all and BMWs would be rusting in car dealerships.

What I find absolutely funny is that the people defending this ZR1's interior are the same ones bitching about say, the EVO's interior. If these clowns stopped defending garbage, maybe GM would actually improve them. Not only GM but Mercedes' and BMWs, Europes elite with their hyperpriced vehicles should also be rightfully criticised for their flaws rather than the respective fanboys constant whining and pitiful excuses. These are also the same clowns saying the the Genesis is a fake without even trying it and also the ones playing the naturally aspirated card when the ZO6 was the GT-Rs rival, "naturally aspirated is the $hit, GT-R needs turbos to beat our a$$ around a track, blah, blah, blah." Now you don't hear a word about boosted engines simply because the ZR1 is utilising them.

"did the ZR1 just fart?"

Nah, the engine block just cracked with all the worship and defense launched by the GM lovers.

"And speaking of excuses for expensive cars, what's the excuse then for the $120K ZR1's laughably inadequate interior, including its Cobalt steering wheel and incredibly cheap seats? Stuff that's out of place on a $50K car much less a $100K+ one."

bimmerjay, there is an unwritten rule about these sites. Bashing imports are heartily recommended but heaven forbid you should say anything about a domestic. Thats when certain people take their heads out of their a$$es and threaten you over the internet(most exciting thing they do). Sad thing is, GM can't even afford to pay these morons.

I just saw the video of the ZR1. Not to make excuses but my current car had 3 miles on the clock when I purchased it and hadnt been driven for weeks according to my dealership. It actually did not start when I went to purchase it. New cars sitting on the lot sometimes have trouble starting due to battery run down. When I brought my previous car in 2005, 3 of them had trouble starting when I arranged for my first test drive and my brother was there witness. They had to use a portable jumper to get the batteries up to snuff and the problem was solved.

So, I say all that to say that perhaps that ZR1 at the dealership had a drained battery since it's been sitting on the lot and likely hasn't been driven. The LT R8 can not use that excuse as it has thousands on miles and is driven on a daily basis. Again, when things are kept in perspective, a lot of arguments hold no water.

It's also interesting that someone like Jay Leno who can afford to drive whatever car he wants seems to like his two C6 Vettes and doesn't share the complaints that magazine writers and the LT Blog peanut gallery seem to harp on over and over.

I'll agree that the Corvette interior, while perhaps nothing special to look at, is quite comfortable and usable. Ultimately, those are two very important items to me as a driver.

I don't, however, agree with the negative comments being thrown at the ergonomics of the BMW interiors. I can see how one could call the interiors "basic" or "bland", but one thing they most certainly are is FUNCTIONAL (perhaps idrive excepted...).

"I think the problem that people have with the ZR1 is that the interior is the same as the base Vette and the ZR1 costs almost three times more."

The base vette starts at close to $50k. That means the ZR1 is about twice as expensive.

"What I find absolutely funny is that the people defending this ZR1's interior are the same ones bitching about say, the EVO's interior. If these clowns stopped defending garbage, maybe GM would actually improve them. "

The EVO's interior is OK for a lancer but its not as nice as other $40k cars. That doesnt mean its not functional. Its in the same boat as the vette. No one believes the vette's interior is a world beater but its functional and attractive. You infer the design is "garbage" but when the C6 came out the press liked the interior and noted it was a vast improvement over the C5. The car is 4 years old now and naturally it's interior isnt avant garde at this stage. Do you REALLY think the C7 isnt going to have a vastly improved interior based on GM's recent efforts? Do you really think that GM is going to read a few comments here and then say "lets not improve the vette interior in 2011 because a few folks at IL said its good enough"? Give me a break.

"bimmerjay, there is an unwritten rule about these sites. Bashing imports are heartily recommended but heaven forbid you should say anything about a domestic."

To make a statement as stupid as the one above suggests you havent been reading or posting here that long.

doug,

The lack of functionality was aimed at BMWs with idrive. A basic BMW interior is straightforward albeit dull and monochromatic.

doug- I was referring to the cryptic radio controls and the lack of an OFF button for the climate controls. That is simply ridiculous if you ask me and distraction for the driver.

1487: thanks for clearing it up. I sort of assumed that's what was being alluded to.

Chavis: I'm not sure I buy that the radio is all that cryptic. The buttons could maybe use better labeling, but I actually find it easier to change settings (bass, treble, etc) in the BMW set up then in many others. Again, I haven't used idrive so I'm not sure if it messes up the radio at all.

jesus you people are picky!

It's the nature of the beast...get over it.

Wait... what happened to talking about the R8 on cold mornings? Anyways, I don't think 41 degrees is very cold. Try firing it up at the artic circle.