2002 BMW M3: What M3 Would You Buy?

I'm not sure what year i'd buy, but either way i'd be building it for racing. I'd have to look at the Competition Package to see if it'd be worth it. Either way, in the end i'd be towing it to and from the track.

Interesting - my '02 Z06 has depreciated less than the '02 M3. When I was looking at purchasing these cars new in 2002, they were both priced very close to each other. The M3 was about $2k more expensive (sticker) mostly because it got socked with a gas guzzler tax, while the Z06 did not (skip shift feature enabled it to squeek past the gas guzzler tax threshold in the city cycle). Edmunds TMV for the '02 Z06 on the same criteria is $22,136, more than $1k higher than the '02 M3.

On a percentage basis utilizing my out-the-door price when new, the depreciation rate is much better on the Z06. At the time I purchased in February 2002, BMW dealers were charging full sticker ($53k), with a 9 month wait list (I had an M3 on order for 6 months before cancelling it and going with the Z06 in February). GM offered rebates on the Corvette for the first time in many years, to help move cars in the post 9-11 recessionary environment. Sticker on my car was $51k, but I paid $47.5k after the rebate and dealer markdowns. So the M3 has depreciated 60.2% since 2002, while my Z06 depreciated 53.4% since 2002.

So much for the theory that American cars or Corvettes in particular depreciate faster than German cars.

I wonder if the high maintenance and repair costs for the M3 has an influence on the lower resale value?

Don't know whether buying your 'fixed' car would be a brilliant idea (because of how well-documented the fixes are) or a terrible one, judging by the repair history thus far and the way you guys 'drive' these cars. I use that term as lightly as you guys use self-restraint on this car...

Based on the cost of repair, I would avoid one of the E46 M3s, as much as I love them and would be happy to own a 6-speed in the bright blue color. With 20 to 30K to spend, I'd buy a brand new Mustang GT, Mini Cooper S with a few JCW parts, a Mazdaspeed 3 or the new Camaro, personally.

None - If I had to have a Bimmer, I'd lease a new one and let the bank take the flyer on residual. Moreover, I wouldn't be worried about costly repairs and maintenance.

Stingray, There's that problem with resale value of American cars biting you in the butt again. I'd really like to buy a used American car, but the resale value is just too high. :)

I'd buy a used Mustang GT w/ manual, and have fun. Has gotta be far cheaper to operate than an M3, and probably has enough performance for the street to keep me happy.

Better yet, I'd get the base new Camaro V6. More refined, plenty fast enough.

Id buy an E36 M3 manual sedan and use the rest of the cash to modify it. =)

If I had 30k to spend on a large sports car, I would drop it on either a Pontiac G8 GT or wait for the new Camaro.

30k sports car? 20k GTO + 10k at Lingenfelter = :-)

Oh, and to stay on topic i'd buy the 2005 that Carmax has here in Vegas. Its extremely nice, perfect shape and dark blue. $32k though, ouch.

Remember the LED tail lights on the MY2004+ (production: 3/2003+) E46 coupes, too! :o)

You guys need to keep driving this M3 longer, I want to see when the engine and tranny fail, which shouldn't be too far off.

give me an original E30 M3 with the flared fenders. i love those '80s BMWs. of course i'd take a euro-spec E36 M3 as well.

In response to z06 resale... Certainly a great car, but what's not in the numbers is the average mileage of these cars. I'm guessing that the m3's of 2002 have quite a bit more miles now than the z06's of 2002. So the prices listed are not directly comparable. E.g. auction/wholesale prices base off "typical" mileage for each model and that could be different for a dedicated sports car and a gt-ish coupe.

Ditto HA4.

I find it interesting -- no, make that annoying -- that so many people love to point out that the Bimmer's upkeep can be expensive compared to whatever their flavor of the month car is -- SO? I want what I want, and I don't really care about how anyone else feels about it. I know what I'm getting into when I get one of these cars.
Hands down, I'd get a 2004. There seems to be fewer issues with that particular year than any other that I've researched. Or I'd check out soontobedivorcedbargains.com and troll for a low-mile 2006.
You guys have made the maintenance and upkeep of this car far more expensive than it could and should have been by not finding a good indie shop or mechanic, but we've beaten you with that stick before.

There are 2001 M5s that's are hitting the $20k mark right now. If I had a garage and a 2nd car, I'd buy that.

Maybe it's just me, but I don't see this M3 having a "scary amount of stuff that has broken or failed". At 63k miles, you'd have to do a 60k mile service and a set of brake pads/rotors. You needed new tires, another regular maintenance item.

You had a Final Stage Resistor Fail and a door lock problem. Lower control arm bushings, which required a new alignment. A power steering hose. And an alternator. Not cheap, but based upon your blog posts none of them left you on the side of the road either. The alternator kept you driving it (unless I mis-read) and the power steering hose was noticed during a servicing.

Scary would be a drivetrain failure or being left on the side of the road several times....at least, to me.

Joe

lvranger, I couldn't agree more.

"By equ on October 20, 2008 6:22 PM
In response to z06 resale... Certainly a great car, but what's not in the numbers is the average mileage of these cars. I'm guessing that the m3's of 2002 have quite a bit more miles now than the z06's of 2002. So the prices listed are not directly comparable. "

equ - not the case with the Edmunds TMV numbers I used - mileage was not a factor. You can pull the TMV value without entering mileage, which is what the original writer did with the M3's value.

Further evidence that your theory doesn't hold water is you can put the actual mileage in, and TMV will adjust off the average for that vehicle. So, for example, an '02 BMW M3 with 60k will have a lower TMV than an '02 Z06 with 60k. Try it yourself if you don't believe me.

"Maybe it's just me, but I don't see this M3 having a "scary amount of stuff that has broken or failed"."

Joe - All this stuff failed in only 13k miles of driving. I wouldn't call it scary, but it is a lot. More stuff has failed on this car at 50k-63k miles than has failed on my truck at 160k-173k. A LOT more.

I'd go with an E46 with the Competition Package. If I wanted to spend less I'd go with an E36 M3. That said, a wild card would be an E46 330i ZHP, which offers performance that is equivalent to the E36 M3 in a somewhat more discreet package. This is all hypothetical at this point as my wife has drawn the line at five cars and two bikes. I think that the 2002 was the (next to) last straw. Spoilsport...

Stingray - Do you do your own maintenance on your truck?

Maybe I'm biased: I don't consider the alternator, FSU, door lock, or power steering hose to be anywhere near major.

On my 03 Saturn Ion, by 58k miles I had had some bushings wear out ($170, no alignment needed) and an ignition switch go need to be replaced(~$200, it prevented you from starting for 15 minutes when it activated the security system). There was some other stuff wrong that I traded it in with....IDK - Just don't consider a few things at 63k miles to be indicative of how it's going to be for the next 50k miles. And just because one person pays exorbitant amounts for those few things doesn't mean the ownership experience is going to be scary.

If the car is accident prone before the last 13k miles, the Previous Owner's records should indicate it.

Joe

Joe -- I agree with your assessment. I don't think you're biased, but obviously, stingray got a good truck and takes care of it. I could say that I had a good Catera, because none of the stuff that other Catera owners were saying happened to them happened to mine.
Of course, comparing a truck to an admittedly high-strung sports coupe is apples to oranges, but both points were made.

Sgude - Agreed. To me, tthe M3 has not been repair-free, but I don't think it's been scary either.

Scary to me is a car you can't rely on or that you are afraid you can't afford. The M3 hasn't hit any of those buttons for me (someone who looks for bang-for-the-buck in the $30k range)....I wouldn't be afraid of the stuff it's needed so far. I'd be on M3 forums finding good deals and DIY write-ups. But that's me, a moderate DIY enthusiast.

Joe

I priced it out and for the maintenance cost per month of a 2002 M3 I can buy a new M3 convertible.

If that is based on Edmunds' costs, then there is no way that has any relevance to any enthusiast that does some of the work him/herself or has a good indie shop or mechanic.

2001 M5s are $20k because they are hideously expensive to maintain.

I believe the LED tail lights were added in 2003.5. Those would be on my must have list.

I agree that 2004+ is the year to have. For me 2006 is too expensive commanding near 40 for most real world examples when nice 335 coupes can be had for that price. Yes not an M3, but comes with a great warranty and is lots of fun, although admitadly a bit soft. The 2005 is the year if you want compettion package, but I could not give up radio controls on my steering wheel even though the revised steering rack would be very tempting. The rest can be added easily to non-CSL. LED tails and the other minor improvements make 2004+ (2003.5) a good option especially when considering taking the car over with a bit of a warranty left.

All great options, but I would also be tempted to look at a Z3 M coupe w/ the e46 M3 engine. If I wanted something more comfy, then 335 coupe is the way to go.

pc123456 - Agreed. I've heard a great statement from M5 owners:

"Don't buy an $80k car for $20k unless you can afford to maintain an $80k car."

Joe

I may be wrong, but I believe there is no MY2003.5 E46 Coupe. As far as I know, MY2004 E46 Coupes began production in 3/2003 and were retailed as MY2004 facelifted E46 Coupes. Notice how changes such as LED tail lights are listed in the changes from 2003 to 2004 section and not the 2003 mid-year one.

The following link may be of some help.
http://www.bimmerfest.com/wiki/index.php?title=BMW_E46#Changes_for_March_2003_Production_.28MY2003_mid-year_changes.29

FYI, the Competition Package (aka 'ZCP' option package) did *not* include forged wheels. They are made by BBS, and look exactly like the CSL wheels, but they are spuncast. The ZCP also adds alcantara steering wheel and e-brake handle, drilled rotors, tighter steering ratio and 'M-track' mode, which is sort of like a Lite version of DSC-Off. Whether all of those were worth $4k new is a matter of much debate on enthusiast forums, but in a used car, it's easier to absorb the premium. Forget about cruise control or any other steering-wheel controls though. Not available on the ZCP cars... only the 'M-Track' button is on the wheel.

The ZCP was also the only way on the E46 M3 you could get what I think was the ultimate M-specific color, Interlagos Blue. It's what I chose when I bought my '06 ZCP in April 2008. ;)

The non-ZCP 19" wheels are forged (& polished), but as 10-15 said, the ZCP's aren't (they are painted). They do look sweeeet though. Cross-drilled ZCP rotors will fit non-ZCP M3's, BTW.

One might think that the latest model years would be more reliable but the M3 forum I visit has shown a surprisingly high # of problems for 05 and 06's.

As for the E39 M5, I love the car and want one, but would never buy it because it has an inherent flaw in the engine. I forget the exact details, but carbon clogs up a valve and trips the Check Engine light (i don't think power is lost tho), and you can't pass SMOG unless you can clear it w/ an expensive cleaning. I think I'd get a E39 540i 6-sp one down the line.

"I forget the exact details, but carbon clogs up a valve and trips the Check Engine light (i don't think power is lost tho), and you can't pass SMOG unless you can clear it w/ an expensive cleaning."

Well, yes and no. The problem is a clogged fresh air passage for the cold start air pump(the pump causes the cats to light off faster)One of the M5 tuners offers a reflash that causes the OBD II to ignore the fault, and thus no CEL.

None of the above. I had a 2002 M3 Convertible that had been a local, meticulously dealer maintained CPO car and it was garbage. The ONLY other BMW I've ever had that was worse was my 2003 E65 745i which was also similarly maintained, and everyone knows what a disaster those beasts are.

In fact, I never came close to achieving the M3 Convertible's advertised 0-60 time and I was never able to get rid of an annoying lifter tick the car always had, which the dealer of course (Reeve's BMW in Tampa, one of the worst BMW dealers I've ever used) claimed was absolutely normal. Just like the shaking and hazy headlights on that 745i.

Ironic, especially considering the other FOUR E46s I had were damn near bulletproof before the M3. Even my 2003 Range Rover (a BMW from stem to stern) was a model of reliability at 100k miles.

So if I had my money to spend on an E46 it would be a 330Ci ZHP Coupe with the Manual. Bar-none the best balanced E46 ever produced. A spirited driver whilst at the same time being perfectly at home on city streets without jarring your teeth out of their sockets. M3? = Overrated. And that's from a long time BMW fanatic.

Oh btw... I replaced that M3 with a much more civil and nearly as pleasing (sans rowing my own gears) Crossfire SRT-6 that's a hoot to drive. It has it's quirks too (lord knows MB is 1000 times worse than BMW) but still tons of fun.

I had a great experience with Reeves Imports when I bought my first GTI. I went there with my Bimmer and had another good experience. Surprising.