2008 Pontiac G8 GT: Tire Pressures and Bold Statements

GOOD!

Is that right that the G8 is trying to be a luxury car? I thought it's just a well-built, good looking, mainstream large sport sedan.

Oh ... perhaps you mistaken the G8 for the Genessis which is a luxury wannabe.

Hmmm i guess it could be considered a luxury car. I'm sure chrysler considers the 300c a luxury car. You cannot really compare the G8 to the dodge Charger without comparing to the 300c. As far as the image the G8 evokes i consider it more of a meat and potatoes performance sedan.

Oh so both of you have a G8 in your garages? The General appreciates your business! Talk is cheap. If you like the car so much, go buy one! I'm sure they could use your money right now. Yes, its good that they can't sell a very good car due to a simple lack of options.

Pontiac compares the G8 to a BMW 550i and copies the styling cues (inside and out) of luxury cars. Not to mention the handling and ride characteristics of said BMW. The interior is nice considering it is a GM product. I'd say it is trying to be a luxury sports sedan.

Hyundai is one of the few who is doing fine in the market right now. No one defending a Pontiac has any business badmouthing Hyundai... the Genesis so far seems to be a magnificent car. The rich Korean businessmen (who usually drive Mercedes Benz's) seem to like it and so does InsideLine.

Give us a break Huy, you're not fooling anyone into thinking you actually would consider buying a G8 or any American car for that matter. You're just another born and raised FOB, brainwashed to hate American product no matter the quality.

It only took 6 comments for this post to turn this G8 post into name calling. I think that's slightly above average?

Which cars do have this feature? A lot of spec lists simply say "tire pressure monitor" or something similar, without specifying whether actual pressure numbers are displayed.

And regarding the latest spat, don't forget the G8 is basically an Australian import. Carry on.

When I first saw this picture, I thought it was another post about the R8, considering how much their information screens look alike..

Scott,

What makes this car better than the CTS (which to me has far better styling inside and much more overall content for not too much more, but whose performance credentials seem to be a little lacking unless you opt for the FE3 suspension and tires)?

To those who don't know, I believe 2008 was the first year in which all vehicles need to be equipped with a tire pressure monitoring system. So they all have it now, but its hit or mix whether or not they have a display showing individual tire pressures specifically.

From my completely non-scientific assessment, about 50% of all cars over 30k have the individual readout....but I've noticed ALOT of GM/Ford cars have this feature (which I find great).

Joe

“What makes this car better than the CTS” - joe

For me, the answer has a lot to do with the G8 GT’s drivetrain.

That 6.0L V8 and 6 speed automatic result in both substantially quicker acceleration and a ( to me ) effortless feel – compared to even the DI V6 in the CTS. And the price is much more aggressive – even with the 2009 ‘bump’. [ sigh ]

I rented a CTS for 5 days. It is “OK”. I’d buy the G8 GT, not the CTS.

- Ray
Torque addict . . .

"That's right, I said it. I think the G8 GT is better than the Cadillac CTS and the Buick Enclave. As good as those two vehicle are, when you look at the Pontiac's price, performance and package it's easily the best of the GM's best."

Easily the best? I dont know about that at all. Its one of GM's better products but it's not "easily" better than the CTS, Malibu, Enclave or Vette. Why cant people just acknowledge that GM has more than one great product instead of constantly trying to point out how one particular model is MUCH better than GM's other offerings. The G8 offers more bang for the buck than the CTS but the CTS handles better, looks better, has far more advanced features and has a far nicer interior.

I AM curious as to how many of you own this car. I visited a dealership yesterday here in Orange County, CA; the '08 models were gone and they only had two '09 models and that's it. The sales people kept saying they were all going for sticker.

So, question is: has anybody been able to get a deal on one of these, especially the GT? They were both going for 33K.

Funny thing is, a few of you have commented on your impression of the car's looks when seeing it in person, but I have NEVER seen one of these on the road. My visit to the lot made for the first time I'd seen one in person. I guess they are selling? Strange I've not seen ANY on the road. I have an issue with paying sticker for a new car, especially given the current economic climate where dealerships are really only selling hybrids, compacts, etc.

Carfreak, the screens do look similar. I thought the same thing.

I was pleasantly surprised to see that it has real tire pressure monitoring and a detailed display. My grandma's Rav4 has the minimum required by law and only has a "tire pressure low" idiot light for a display. The light goes on every other day. Since Toyotas cannot possibly go wrong, her tires must be perpetually underfilled and all our gauges and the mechanics' gauges must be wrong. Odd.

“…but the CTS handles better…” - 1487

Well – better, but better enough to matter to a typical potential buyer? And better based on what, exactly?

C+D’s test of the to FE3 CTS was ‘rained out.
R&T’s results from testing of the CTS and the G8 GT are below.
My guess is that the handling differences would be too subtle for most drivers to discern – and though less understeer may be of interest, the testers are typically describing “at the limit” behavior. Something I have no interest in exploring on public roads. And note that if the R&T G8 GT test unit had been equipped with the optional Sport Package, with higher performance 19” tires, I suspect that the difference would be almost eliminated.

OTOH, the acceleration is rather dramatically better in the G8 GT. A full second quicker in 0 – 60 and through the Quarter Mile, compared to the CTS with the top \ optional V6 motor. I believe that many of us with finely calibrated ‘butt dyno’s will notice that level of difference in acceleration. And while I could never condone pushing the absolute cornering limits, except on a race track, I find safe places to hit WOT in my Corvette most every time I drive it. Though rarely for more than several ( rather exhilarating ) seconds at a time. In order to stay [ mostly ] legal.

Available features, I’ll concede. The G8 is not being marketed as a luxury sedan.

And the interior of the CTS may be ‘far nicer’ – from the standpoint of materials & finish – but the G8 GT’s MSRP of $31.5K to $34K is a whole lot less than a CTS that is comparably equipped, from a performance \ handling standpoint – at $40K-ish. And in my hours driving that CTS rental, I was not impressed with the ergonomics or the choices of finish.

For some, the CTS is clearly ‘better’. I’d choose the G8 GT. But that only means that it is better ‘FOR ME’.

And I’d have a few bucks left over – to pump a few more gallons of gas into the G8’s tank . . .

But that’s just me.

- Ray
I do wish the G8 GT was offered with a HUD . . .

= = =

http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=31&article_id=6147

HANDLING
Lateral accel * 0.86g
Balance mild understeer
Slalom speed** 66.6 mph
Balance mild understeer
*(200-ft skidpad); ** 700-ft slalom, 100-ft spacing.

0–1320 ft (¼ mile) 14.5 @ 98.2 mph

Time to speed CTS G35 S
0 –120 mph na
0 –110 mph na
0 –100 mph 15.0
0 –90 mph 12.3
0 –80 mph 10.0
0 –70 mph 7.8
0 –60 mph 6.0
0 –50 mph 4.6
0 –40 mph 3.2
0 –30 mph 2.1
0 –20 mph 1.2
0 –10 mph 0.3

http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/download/0608_g8_dp2.pdf

G8 GT – note –
These numbers are with-OUT the wider, summer optional 19” wheels & tires:

handling
Lateral acceleration* 0.85g
Balance moderate understeer
Slalom speed** 64.3 mph
Balance moderate understeer

0–1320 ft (¼ mile) n 13.5 @ 104.9 mph

Time to speed, sec
0–120 mph 17.9
0–110 mph 14.9
0–100 mph 12.3
0–90 mph 10.0
0–80 mph 8.2
0–70 mph 6.6
0–60 mph 5.0
0–50 mph 3.8
0–40 mph 2.8
0–30 mph 1.9
0–20 mph 1.1
0–10 mph 0.4

blobster,

I am not surprised the G8 GT is selling in OC. With small inventory and the market (loves displacement), I'm sure they sell all of them.

Maybe try further north in LA county.

I haven't seen many on the road but a couple. I think they look really great. They have a solid presence that isn't "look at me!" it is understated like the German sports sedans.

I love the big flares and clean style. I far prefer the G8 exterior to the CTS. The only hiccup is the taillights which look a little too import scene/ebay. Solid red would have been cleaner I think.

Does anyone know if the rear seats fold down for extended cargo?

No, the rear seats just have a middle fold-down arm rest in between the left and right sides so that you can place elongated objects from the trunk and allow them to protrude into the cabin. This is the closest thing you get to a fold down, though after sitting in the back seat of the car, I noticed it was a very wide opening, so...

I've seen about 10-15 on the road between the suburbs of Philadelphia and the beach this summer (I've only been to the beach twice, once this weekend). I do consider them to have presence, but I don't think they are understated.

The G8 is definitely graceful from the side profile, but the front end is not graceful (IMO) due to the grill design & hood scoops. The rear end has those milhouse-wide-and-small tail lights that just doesn't blend or match it's overwise nicely sculpted rear.

So I don't think it has mastered the elegant and understated grace and class of, say, a 1997-2003 5-series sedan or 2001-2006 BMW 3-series, or the 1996-2002 Audi A4 (those are what I think of when I think timeless german sports sedan look).

That being said, neither have the germans. Witness Audi's 2003-2005 bloated A4, or the 2006-2008 BMW 3-series (now being nip and tucked for '09). Witness the 04+ 5-series, which lost it's classic look.

I hope GM's penchant for bringing out new models and killing them after one cycle does not expand to the G8. And I hope the G8 has a full cycle refresh some time in the future to help blend it's front end into a more natural shape, address it's rear-end, and add that 6-speed I so desperately want :)

Joe

P.s. Does anyone have handling numbers from a CTS with an FE2 suspension and tires? There are worlds of difference between what 95% of CTS's can do and what the FE3 CTS can do, in the handling department.

That's not a knock on the CTS.....most BMW 3-series are sold as 325/328s with the 16" wheels and non-sport suspension, and they aren't the handling gods that are the 335i w/ sport package.

I was beside a G8 at the border yesterday, so I had lots of time to have a look at the profile. I really don't see the 5-series resemblance at all. I would never confuse those two cars on the road, and I have trouble believing that even a non-enthusiast would.

To clarify: I dont think the CTS is far and away superior to the G8. The CTS is a better overall car to me but it comes with a substantial price hike. My point was simply that it's hard to say that the CTS or G8 or Enclave are "easily" Gm's best product. The CTS and G8 are two compelling RWD options.

Joe:

You have to remember that the transmissions on the G8 are dictated by what's sold in Austalia. If the Commodore gets a new V6 or standard 6 speed auto than I'm sure the G8 will as well. A standard 6 speed would help acceleration and mileage slightly, but it wouldn't be a dramatic improvement.

1487 - I meant 6-speed manual transmission. Isn't one of those offered in Australia? Didn't Lutz say one would be offered in the U.S. within the next year or so (though possibly in the GXP version?).

Not really looking for mileage, though I do think a 6-speed with a serious overdrive would dramatically help highway mileage on this car. I really just want the manual transmission.

And though I say "6-speed", I want a 6-speed with some seriously tall gearing. A proper V8 such as this deserves some really nice tall gearing for those long in-gear pulls ;)

Joe

I've only seen on G8 on the road, and a handful in parking lots. I've seen more Fortwos on the road around here (Chicago).

To the original point, aren't all cars required to have tire pressure monitors by a certain date?

"1487 - I meant 6-speed manual transmission. Isn't one of those offered in Australia? Didn't Lutz say one would be offered in the U.S. within the next year or so (though possibly in the GXP version?)."

yes the GXP will have a manual. This was confirmed months ago when the car debuted. The mileage will not be great and there may even be a gas guzzler tax.

"To the original point, aren't all cars required to have tire pressure monitors by a certain date?"

I think warnings will be required by a certain date. I dont know if you need exact readouts for each tire though. I cant see that feature being standard on Aveos and Yaris'.

Something I read elsewhere led me to believe that the TPM's will be required by a certain date, but that specific pressure readouts per tire won't. Supposedly a system with the ability to detect that any tire is below a safe level and alert the driver will be sufficient, so that some manufacturers have tied into the ABS system somehow to calculate pressure based on the revolutions of the tire (and resistance?), without adding any real hardware at all.

Many GM vehicles now show individual tire pressure though. The 2007 Avalanche and Trailblazer, as well as my 2008 Malibu all do this. The biggest difference is whether or not you can easily see all four tires at a glance, or whether you need to move through individual screens (1, 2, or 4 visible at a time depending on the vehicle).

As of September 2007, all manufactured cars for the U.S. have a Tire Pressure Monitoring System. It already exists in all U.S. new cars as of right now.

Many cars don't have individual pressure readouts because they implemented the TPMS without a display which could utilize the information. I'm sure their next gen will rectify that.

How almost all TPMS warning systems work is that if one tire gets 25% lower in pressure than the others, a light will go off warning you of that.

The upside is that if you drive in a situation such a sand with lower tire pressures, your light won't go off. The downside is that if all of your tires are low, you won't know until you check.

That's my understanding. My 08 Legacy GT has individual wheel sensors built into the wheel/valve itself. I think almost all TPMS systems work this way, as you need to get a replacement TPMS sensor if you need a new wheel or if one breaks.

It does not work off of ABS because a tire could appear to be rotating differently if it had overly worn tread....or, heck, if you were doing donuts :)

The downside to the individual readouts is that most cars need to be reset when you rotate the tires. The sensors don't automatically know which side of the car they are attached too. Therefore, if you rotate front-to-back without resetting your display will show your front tires pressure while it'll really be the back.

For me, I keep a portable tire pump in my trunk so I can maintain my 36-38 PSI :)

Joe

My G8 reads out the individual pressures in a weird order
LR RR
LF RF
Anyone else?