2008 Scion xB: Where's My MPGs?

Having the aerodynamics of a school bus probably doesn't help either.

With the first gen. xB all the owners were complaining about how much power their boxes lacked. Now the second generation, with an engine designed to move all the heft of a Rav4, is criticized for its lack of fuel economy. Maybe next time around Toyota will split the difference with a 2.0L that gets around 30mpg.

When the first gen Xb was out, gas was $2.50/gallon. Toyota overreacted and kind of messed up the formula. They need to pull back and get the Xb hitting on "cool" and "practical" instead of "square Camry".

"Maybe next time around Toyota will split the difference with a 2.0L that gets around 30mpg."

Samjpatrick: I think you've approximately described the base engine in the Corolla/Matrix. I think the most practical choice in this category would be the the Pontiac Vibe with the same base engine (but with the far superior GM warranty).

Too bad that engine only gets the old 4-spd automatic, instead of the 5-spd on the 2.8.

^ 2.4 I mean. Ack, I liked it when we could edit comments...

The new xB has decent aerodynamics. It does have a high frontal area, but its drag coefficient of 0.32 isn't bad: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_drag_coefficients

We have a 1st gen at home, and don't feel that the new one is the same vehicle at all. It's just a small crossover now - a segment in which boxiness isn't anything special. I don't think Toyota had any chance of keeping the weight down around the 2500lb level, but they did go too far. There's still a demand for practical subcompacts.

It would have been nice to have the option of a new 1st-gen xB when I bought my Fit! I like those cars a lot, especially in white. I've always found Toyota build quality to be superior to Honda, and the 1st gen xB was cheaper, to boot. Our family's Tercel, Prius and Solara have never had a single issue in 70k, 80k and 120k miles, respectively. The Fit had a problematic power window at 8k. Toyota has gone downhill lately in terms of product design and planning, though.

To add insult to injury: the Japanese version of the xB (the Corolla Rumion) gets a 1.8L with a CVT - and manages to get 15.4 km/l (just under 37mpg US) in mixed-mode driving. Why can't we have *that* car here in the US?

http://toyota.jp/corollarumion/spec/spec/index.html
http://toyota.jp/corollarumion/ecology/index.html

I don't understand why Toyota and Subaru have been so stubborn about 5 speed autos.

There's a reason (besides superior aerodynamics)that a 400hp Corvette can almost match the highway efficiency of a 132hp Scion, a deep, highway biased overdrive.

True, the huge difference in HP and torque affect how deep the overdrvie can be on a small 4-cyclinder car, but with enough gears to chose from, you can have a deep O/D that allows for superior economy on relatively flat roads.

The previous Xb didn't get particulary great mileage when you consider it's engine was small and barely made 100 hp. The nominal decline in mileage was definitely worth it for enough power to at least get out of its own way.

That said, highway MPG would improve substantially with a 5th and or 6th dear ala the Fit and Mini.

Toyota offers a 5-speed auto in the Matrix and Corolla, and it's even hooked to the same 2.4L that's in the Scion. Scion's are usually little more than leftover parts (the tC is built on an Avensis platform that dates back to the mid-90s) with oddball bodywork, flashing lights, cool stereos and an obnoxious fixed pricing scheme. Anyone who does ten minutes of research will realize that a better deal usually exists right on the other side of the Toyota dealer's lot.

Toyota took a gamble with the new xB (and xD) and lost. Now they have to figure out whether they try and fix it, or let sales languish and ultimately euthanize the brand.

Yeah, but as I said, Toyota does not offer the 5-spd auto with the smaller-displacement (and more economical) versions of the Corolla and Matrix.

ALL automakers -- even the ones with strong fuel-economy cred -- desperately need more cogs in their base-level automatics.

The only exceptions I can think of off the top of my head are the Versa with the CVT, and the Civic with the 5AT.

Little changes. Change the four speed auto in favor of the 5/6 speed. Surprisingly the new Matrix has the five speed on the 2.4L. And there is still loads of air drag due to its square design. But has room to spread. I think they will incorporate a 5/6 speed if they find it effective and necessary.

The 5 speed wont help the mileage of the Scion. The Corolla S has mediocre mileage. In fact the drop off between the base corolla with the 1.8L engine and the 2.4 equipped model is huge. The Malibu gets the same mileage as the Corolla S even though it weighs about 400lbs more.

"Toyota took a gamble with the new xB (and xD) and lost"

Lost? What lost? Have you checked the Scion sales recently? The new xB is actually selling better than the old one and the xD is pretty much on par (if not better) than the xA that it replaced.

tC is the one that's hurting Scion's sales but given that it's due for a model change that's really not unexpected.

Why yes, I have checked the Scion xB sales recently!

2004: 47,013
2005: 54,037
2006: 61,306
2007: 45,834
2008: 25,926 (Jan-June)

Doubling 2008's results thus far nets us a figure just shy of 52,000 cars. 2007's results are moot because of the model changeover and the slow roll out of the 2g xB's (hard to sell what you don't have). So while yes, xB sales are *up* for 2008 compared to 2007, they're still off the pace of 2005 and 2006 - years where Scion was still expanding its dealer network.

The xD's sales are on par with the xA's. xD sales may suffer as the 5-door Yaris is introduced next year, which can be had for a lot less money and gets better mileage. I hope they don't, because the xD is the better car.

I rented a 2nd gen xB a few months ago while my Matrix XRS was in the shop and enjoyed it greatly - except for the gas mileage. The Matrix has 20+ more HP than the Scion and regularly returns between 28 and 33 mpg - and I drive it pretty hard. The Scion could barely crack 20 in two weeks with us, and that was with my law-abiding wife doing most of the driving. The xB is a great car overall, but I will never consider one until they fix the mileage issue.

Let me be clear here - I *want* Scion to succeed. It's a great idea and they've brought some great ideas to the table. But they screwed up with the xB's engine and transmission combination - especially when they have other options already available on the other side of the Pacific.

Wow that is some low MPGs. Are you guys all boulder salesmen who keep inventory in the back seat?

I am driving a manual on 50/50 city/freeway and I am getting 30 MPG on my gen2 xB.