2008 BMW X5: Introduction

Yeah, I don't get the 3rd row either. You guys even know how bad/useless those are. Why waste the money?

How many people who plink down 70 grand on an SUV care what a car review site thinks, anyway? Seems like a giant waste of money. Then again, I'm not a patrician, so none of these loaded, top-end cars appeal to me. I'd much rather see long-term tests on cars people actually buy and care about, not just the dreams to which they think they aspire.

I think they probably got it with the third row seat because that way they can compare it to their other large passenger cars (sorry, i mean crossovers), like the cx-9, Enclave....

I was about to bemoan IL's choice to once again buy the more powerful engine that only represents a small portion of sales...but then I remembered that there are already three 6-cyl crossovers in the fleet. So in that case, live a little. Go for the V8.

Something so wrong about spending more on options than on some entire new cars...

Sabastian you forgot the Ford Edge, that's four 6 cyl crossovers in the fleet. Throw in the Rondo and thats five, and it shows how uneeded an X5 is. A minivan would have been a better choice, or a used Corvette or something cool.
 
ahightower - completely agree. $13K of options!!

Yeah, there really are way too many crossovers. How about another subcompact, now that the Fit is on its way out? Seems like a much more relevant source of information, instead of yet another CUV.

And regular updates from every vehicle in the fleet, not just the popular ones.

I guess what I don't get is the fact that there's nothing earth-shatteringly new or notable about the current X5.

hmm, alright i'll admit it. i'd rather spend the 30k on the ferrari and have 30k in the bank for repairs then this thing.

Donna,
 
It says on the bottom of the intro that BMW supplied you the X5 for evaluation - but there's the whole "Why we bought it" section. I guess what I'm wondering is if you did buy it, how did the actual purchase go?

That sunroof is enormous. I think in only a few years, sunroofs have gone from tiny holes to enormous panoramic vistas a la targa. I also note the red-red radio display. I wonder if we'll get some Aura-esque wash out? haha.
 
Overall, though, thats a staggering amount of options.....

skisupreme: this happens alot, edmunds didn't buy this car. BMW is lending them the car. Edmunds has a mixed bag of edmunds owned, and lent cars.

opfreak - BMW has free maintenance for 4years/50,000miles.
 
daytona - Wow, yeah. I did forget those others. Crossovers are pretty big nowadays, though.
 
bemanix - The Fit is going to be staying for a while longer while they see if the transmission decides to eat itself again.

They added a Smart car - how's that for "subcompact"? But I agree there are a lot of CUV's in the fleet. What are we going to learn from this X5 test? It's another sweet Bimmer. Looks good, handles great, too damn expensive. Might have been nice to get another diesel into the fleet, like a GL320 CDI, instead, but they already have the Q7.
 
Oh well, compared to the print mags, Edmunds offers a lot more frequent and detailed info on their long-termers, and the price is right too, so I guess we shouldn't complain too much.
 
I am interested to see how they compare the X5 to the CX-9. Does it handle that much better, is it really worth the extra cost? I think I'd rather have a CX-9 AND a MazdaSpeed3 or Miata.

sabastian, No I meant that if I had to buy this or the ferrari. I'd take the red old slow car. (which i'm not a fan of). I know the bmw would be 'free' to fix. But the x5 does so much less for me.

I think I'd rather have a CX-9 AND a MazdaSpeed3 or Miata.
 
Agreed.

reliner, here here. complete argee, cx9 too big for me. But I drove a rav4, i'd rather have that in 4wd, with a v6, and a mspd3 and still have ~15k in the bank.

Let's not forget- in order to cast BMW is the best possible light they had to get the V8 as the fleet's V6 powered CUVs outmuscle the X5 3.0si's 260hp/225lbs-ft.

My brother has this exact same X5. I've sat in the 3rd row seats, it is pure torture for an adult but fine for a kid.
The reality is that the car is not long enough for real 3rd row seats. When they are deployed, there is very little luggage room behind them.
The car drives like it is carved out of a block of steel. Just smothers the road, handles great, accelerates great. Fantastic seats, great vision. Really a tremendous vehicle for those that can afford it.
Cars like the Mazda CX9, Dodge Caravan etc are not even close w/ regards to ride, handling, feel. But they are much cheaper and different vehicles. Not worse, different. The BMW is for those that are not concerned with max cargo/people carriage, while the minivans are more pedestrian and utilitarian. Not worse, different.
As for those who say, for the price of the X5 they can get a miata and a CX9, well, the owners of the X5 can say for the price of a Cayenne Turbo, they can get an X5 and a Z4....
It's all relative.

I agree, desmo. Premium badge buyers have a different set of comparisons in mind. Also, it's easy to say you'd rather have a ________ and a _________, plus $x in the bank, but don't forget that the more popular BMWs are comparatively inexpensive to lease, and as far as I know, a sizable majority of BMW drivers do, in fact, lease. BMW fans know that between BMWCCA memberships, owner loyalty discounts, and BMW subsidizing certain leases, not to mention the option to use European delivery, lease payments become far more reasonable. There are fewer rich people on the road than you think.

even leasing a bmw means you spend as much as a cheaper car.
 
a 70grand suv, thats worth what? 62% after 3 years, means you are paying 26,600 dollars.

Hmmm...interesting choice. I think it's a handsome SUV, and I'm excited to read the blogs about it!

BMW's current lease offers:
 
BMW X5 4.8i starting at $729/month for 36 months with $4,429 down
 
As configured -
 
$1,015/month for 36 months (15k miles per year) with $4,715 down
 
Financing -
 
36 months, 5% interest, $2,500 down = $1,979 / month

That's more than my mortgage. So unless the X5 has three bedrooms, two baths, and a bit over 2100 sq ft, I'm not interested.

orang, your comparing apples and oranges.
 
downpayments on leases are a terrible idea, all you are doing is perpaying your monthly payment. So without the down payment, the x6 costs about 1145 a month.

another pointless addition. Why cant they just poll readers before adding vehicles to the fleet? This is not a volume seller and we all know most people wouldnt get the V8 anyway. Then again, since they arent spending any money they might as well get vehicles with all the options that regular folks typically would skip. More proof that they add vehicles to satisfy their personal tatstes than to give readers any insight into interesting models. This is as silly as having a LT Accord, Ferrari, Camry, etc. Get models that people are not knowledgable about and appeal to a wide range of people. The CTS makes sense, a V8 BMW SUV for $70k makes no sense, especially when its not that different from the last model. Bet we wont read a bunch of posts complaining about its poor mileage though.

So please tell us, 1487, what's not a pointless addition beside products from you beloved GM? This SUV might not be a volume seller in your neck of woods but for some reason I see them all the time around where I live.
 
Also, since it is one of the best selling luxury SUVs and recently just received an all new design I think it is a very good idea to add the X5 into the LT fleet.
 
By the way, I do agree with the idea that the V6 makes more sense than the V8 for the long term test purpose.

I'll answer for that you louiswei. Cars that are worth testing for an entire year are those which are all new and highly improved over the previous model, or vehicles in a new segment, or a vehicle that is critical to a manufacturer's success. The previous X5 was pretty solid, and the new is nothing more than a third row and some nifty options.
 
It just so happens that GM is on a roll right now and a lot of their new cars deserve a lot of praise, such as the Malibu, Enclave, G8, CTS, plus the new trucks and SUVs. Btw 1487 never implied that GM was glorious to him or anything, he just gave the CTS as an example.

Opfreak: The numbers I quoted are from BMW. That is, their current leasing offers require a certain down payment plus associated fees. And what are the apples and oranges? I merely wanted to show what it costs to lease one of these beasts, as leasing was brought up earlier in the comments.

"This is as silly as having a LT Accord, Ferrari, Camry, etc."
 
The importance to the consumer of the Ferrari test is debatable, but the Camry and Accord are two of the best-selling cars in America. I would consider a long term test of those two anything but "silly."

orangutan, check out the prices paid forum. You'll see far better deals than the default one quoted on bmwusa.com. It's still expensive to lease an X5 4.8 compared to your average car, but my point was it's less than you might think. X5s are absolutely everywhere, at least where I live, and I used to wonder how so many people could afford them.
 
And daytona, I think I heard a few forum regulars fall out of their seats laughing over your last sentence.

ewilfong,
 
I'm much aware of 1487's history, but I'm not big on judging people's history myself. The point of my post was that 1487 was not trying to promote GM in his post, he was merely using the CTS as an example because it was recently acquired as an LT car. He was just saying what everyone else has been thinking - that the X5 wasn't the best vehicle to get.
 
With the Accord and Camry, on the one hand it is kind of pointless to test them because you know how they'll perform and hold up given their reputation. But if you are going to test them, it doesnt make sense to go for a loaded $31K Accord seeing how few people buy that. Same with the Altima.

daytona_500, I don't think we are judging a forum member's "history" but rather judging him by his "track record".
 
Let's see how well the X5 fits in your criteria:
 
All new - yes, it may look like the previous one but it is an all new design
 
Highly improved - maybe not since the previous gen X5 was already one of the best, if not the best luxury performance SUVs out there
 
Critical to a manufacturer's success - I would say the X5 is very critical to BMW's success, at least in the NA market if not globally.
 
So let's see, that's 2.5/3.0, to me that's a worthy addition to the long term fleet.

louis - Keep in mind that is your subjective rating of the X5. So I'll give mine....=)
 
All new? The CX-9 is all new, so is the "new" Accord. The X5? Hard to mention it in the same breath
 
Improved? Debatable - I would hope that BMW wouldn't share the same self righteous sentiments about improving their product. Regardless, I wouldn't consider the X5 the pinnacle of a "Performance SUV" (which smacks a bit oxymoronic anyway), there are plenty of other great choices that have beaten the X5 in comparisons.
 
Critical to MFG's success? Again, debatable. Considering, in the US, the 3 series regularly outsells the X5 by over 400%, I'd say the 3 series is the bread and butter for BMW USA. Even the 5 series sales roughly double the X5's total volume here in the states. Most of those X5s sold must be concentrated in the LA and Greenwich, CT areas... ;)
 
Given the above, I would give it more like .5-1 out of 3....=)

There is simply no logical way to explain this latest acquisition. It's a BMW and a SUV, that's the end of the story. It also seems that Edmunds is trying to justify this addition by way of the useless third row seats since the other SUVs offer 3 rows. The current X5 isn't much different from the old generation and is definitely not a game changing segment buster. Basically, it holds no significance in the market place unlike the original version. As others have stated, this particular model is not an accurate representation of the majority of X5s on the road (same goes for a loaded Accord). This is especially egregious since Edmunds did not pay for the vehicle so any trace of fiscal responsibility is thrown out the window.
  
Also, why are the X5 and Q7 loaded while the Edge and Enclave are lower level trims? If you read the introduction to the Enclave, you'll see they were cautious about adding options because of the escalating price. Penny pinching the Enclave led to numerous posts about the lack of seat heaters on it's standard cloth seats. Apparently if you're getting a BMW instead, price is no longer of concern.

But how many SAVs have cut their teeth at the Nürburgring? :o)
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1f9Ib2iNdIU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=af1lKI97cWY

Thank you Suby, that was exactly my point. X5 is considered as the one of the premier performance crossovers UNIVERSALLY along with Porsche Cayenne. It may has lost to others in some comparos but I can guaranteed that's hardly due to its performance.
 
Tryan, as long as there is a model change instead of just a facelift then the newer model is considered as "brand new". You can have your own definition on that topic but I am going by the industry's here. Also, as long as the model is not a niche product then it is critical to a brand's success in some degree. Not to mention that X5 currently serves as BMW's flagship crossover. Not important in the NA market? Hardly.

I certainly understand the argument against getting a loaded anything when a large portion of buyers get the lower trim level. People want to hear about the car they'll buy.
 
On the other hand, this is a TEST fleet, and adding more options means there's more stuff to test. If I'm going to buy an X5 with only a few options, reading reviews of ALL the options will make it easier for me to choose which ones I want.
 
Finally, just because YOU wouldn't or can't buy an X5 doesn't mean there aren't a lot of other people who will really enjoy reading about the ownership experience.

"So please tell us, 1487, what's not a pointless addition beside products from you beloved GM? This SUV might not be a volume seller in your neck of woods but for some reason I see them all the time around where I live. "
 
Look at the sales charts, not your neighborhood. The X5 does OK but isnt near the RX or MDX in sales. firthermore most people are not buying the V8. Vehicles that should be tested are new designs that bring something new to the market or represent something different from a certain manufacturer. I think the Lancer, Enclave, CTS, Azera, CX-9, etc. are examples of good additions. People dont know a lot about these models and they show promise. There is nothing new we need to know about the X5, nor is it a new concept. The 2008 model is just a slightly larger version of the 2000 model with a new interior. What exactly are we going to learn from a year with the X5? Stop arguing for the sake of arguing. If you haven't learned this yet I typically have a basis for my comments. As far as I can tell your basis is that you don't like much of anything but you REALLY dont like it if its American.
 
As for the Ring, the SRX was developed over thre. The FX is another sporty luxury SUV that offers great handling even if it wasnt developed on the Ring.
 
The Accord and camry are not worth testing because they are proven entities and nothing in a year long test is going to convince someone who didnt want one to buy one. What is the point in testing best sellers that have huge ad budgets and loyal followings? There is none. IL got a LT camry and wasnt even thrilled with it but they just had to have one since its a best seller. The F150 is a best seller but I dont have an urge to drive one for a year.

ewilflong- if that's the case than every car needs to be fully loaded in the fleet. The Veracruz, Edge, CX9 nor the Enclave are top trim levels. How do you explain that? You can't because there's no method to their madness. Again, BMWs are held at different standard. You are completely missing the point- sure I could care less about an X5 but I know some people will and that's fine. The fact remains that fully loaded vehicles are more appealing to buyers at all levels so you focus more on the gagdets than other aspects of the vehicle. If a car lacks nav, MMI, computer screens, joysticks, DVD players etc, there's more time to focus on other issues (ie Accord versus Aura).
  
Suby- A 5000+lbs SUV that can't seat six people comfortably ought to be able to do something well. A 'Ring rounding SUV still a contridiction in my book and utterly pointless. Give me a 535 wagon any day over this overweight slug of steel or give me a REAL crossover with a smooth ride space for people and there stuff.

1487 - I didn't know the SRX was tested at the 'Ring. Good find. :o)
 
chavis10 - That's a valid point. How about a Forester 2.5 XT with a manual tranny? Or there's always the new STI? :o) It's too bad Europe has the E61 M5 Touring but North America doesn't. :(

Suby- now there's something Edmunds should add (Forester turbo). I think that's a vehicle that wouldn't otherwise get a lot of press after introduction. It's fast, affordable and provides plenty of utility.

The 2009 Forester XT is slushbox-only (a 4-speed one at that). No thank you!

Louiswei - As always, you are entitled to your opinion, as is everyone else.
 
I will, however, note that I never said the X5 wasn't important in the North American Market, I merely insinuated that it is considerably less important (in terms of raw sales numbers) than the 3 series and 5 series.
 
Also, niche products can and do play a role in a brands success, even if their sales numbers aren't spectacular. These vehicles often contribute greatly to a brands public perception or just give them "bragging rights". How else do you explain the existence of the Bugatti Veyron? The Honda FCX? BMW Z8?
 
Not that I am inferring the X5 is a niche vehicle, but its importance to the brand probably lies closer to the mundane - such as being able to have a full lineup in the showroom - than contributing to sales.

Wow, big whup the X5 was tested at the ring. As I recall so were the SS models of the Cobalt, HHR and Trailblazer.
 
All of you bring up good points - why tick off every option box on the X5 and not on the Enclave and Veracruz? Makes no sense. The third row is the biggest waste of all, it's not going to be utilised or be very comfortable so its pointless.
 
But for what is worth, at least Edmunds is adding a loaded Dodge Grand Caravan as well, we'll see how that turns out.

Bugatti Veyron: look ma, I have 1000hp and can go super fast!
 
Honda FCX: Look out world, here comes the first production hydrogen fuel cell car but we are only offering it through a limited lease program in limited regions...
 
BMW Z8: I am a niche top end convertible which didn't last too long in the BMW lineup. James Bond loves me though...
 
BMW 3-series: The bread and butter for BMW in the entry level luxury sedan segment
 
BMW 5-series: The bread and butter for BMW in the midsize luxury sedan segment
 
BMW X5: The bread and butter for BMW in the luxury CUV/SUV segment.
 
Still think the X5 lies closer to Veyron, FCX and Z8? Okay...

chavis10, you are probably correct that BMWs are held to a different standard, as are other luxury nameplates. I theorize that Edmunds is more likely to put gadgets in their luxury purchases for at least two reasons. First, luxury buyers may be more gadget-oriented consumers, so they want to hear about expensive options. Second, we often see new or revised technology introduced in the luxury segment first. It makes sense to test part of what makes this segment so expensive in the first place.

BMW bought themselves a year's worth of advertising for under $70,000. What bad is Edmunds going to say about it, save some catastrophic failure? A year isn't long enough for reliability issues truly to crop up, while all the goodies will placate the staff. Who wants to bet BMW went over this thing with a fine-tooth comb before sending it to Edmunds, too?

I can't wait to hear more about this baby! :)

"Who wants to bet BMW went over this thing with a fine-tooth comb before sending it to Edmunds, too?"
 
I think most, if not all, long term cars were obtained through local dealerships. BMW (or any other manufactures) wouldn't know which one would Edmunds end up with.
 
So yeah, want to put your car key on the table?

Louiswei - I have to admit, you're very good at twisting things so that they support an argument you're trying to make...
 
I never said the X5 is a niche vehicle in the same vein as the Z8, FCX, etc..in fact I said words to the opposite. So yeah, read closer next time.
 
The X5 may be BMW's best selling SUV (though the X3 is close), but it's sales numbers pale in comparison to the 3 Series and 5 Series. To put it another way, if the X5 died tomorrow, BMW USA would still be around and maybe a little sad. If the next 3 Series (for some reason) bombed and was DOA to the market, they'd have a sizeable problem.

"Louiswei - I have to admit, you're very good at twisting things so that they support an argument you're trying to make... "
 
Here are your exact words:
 
"Not that I am inferring the X5 is a niche vehicle, but its importance to the brand probably lies closer to the mundane - such as being able to have a full lineup in the showroom - than contributing to sales."
 
Seems to me you look at the X5 as a model that BMW made in order to fill a "not so popular" segment instead of their bread and butter unit. If I misunderstood what you were trying to imply then I apologize.
 
"if the X5 died tomorrow, BMW USA would still be around and maybe a little sad"
 
I'll believe that when I hear from a BMW official.

"The manufacturer provided Edmunds this vehicle for the purposes of evaluation."
 
I apologize to orangutan for the earlier comment, I now stand corrected (and my key is off the table...).
 
To Edmunds: If the X5 is provided by the manufacturer then why did you write it like you bought it. I have to say the article is a really really really bad writeup and it'll forever leave a dent on Edmunds' credibility.

Accepted, louis. Now you understand my post above. To note, the CX-9 is also manufacturer-provided.

"But for what is worth, at least Edmunds is adding a loaded Dodge Grand Caravan as well, we'll see how that turns out."
 
I can tell you how that is going to work out. They will criticize the cheap plastics and deem it less refined and thus inferior to the Honda minivan. I am glad they are getting a loaded version though.
 
One would think its more realistic to get a loaded Enclave or Edge since they are thousands less than a loaded X5 but apparently IL disagrees. They made a point of stressing how they wanted their Enclave to be a stripper model but they never explained why. Most Enclaves I am seeing appear to be the CXL model so I don't think the average Enclave buyer is walking away with a cloth equipped base model. As for the notion that most luxury buyers are willing to shell out big bucks for higher end trims, big engines and high tech features it should be noted that the lower end of a luxury nameplate is usually the best seller. The 530 and 535 outsell the 550, the X5 with I-6 outsells the 4.8i model, the 328 outsells the 335i, etc. Most luxury buyers do NOT opt for the loaded version of a luxury nameplate because in most cases the price is prohibitive. IL should have gotten an X5 equipped realistically as they attempted to do with the Enclave. Of course, that would have left them with less features to love and made the X5 seem more mediocre so that was likely out of the question. Kind of like getting an Accord with the I-4 and no nav was out of the question even though that is how most are sold.