2008 Mercedes C300: How Much For The 3-Pointed Star?

I'm with you Brent. The C300 is pretty overpriced for what you actually get. The G is much better value, but if it makes you feel any better, it's pretty much the same story with the 328i and the base CTS.

Finally someone speaks some sense about this car... By the way, what's the horsepower again?
 
My IS350 has autodimming mirror, keyless entry/ignition, HomeLink and leather seating with 306hp on top of that. I paid $36k (before tax and title) for that back in 2006 and I believe Edmunds paid $39,450 for the C300...

You ask "Where's all the stuff?" but from what I recall you chose the car with the stuff it has and did not buy a car with the other stuff.....all but the memory seats could have been included in some upgraded packages, but for more money.
 
If I buy the car equipped with P1 instead of P2 only to turn around and complain that my car doesn't have split folding rear seats.....who is to blame....the mercedes salesman or me for not buying the car with the features I want?
 
If on the other hand, you purchased a fully loaded C300 and pointed out that your fully loaded C300 is significantly more expensive than your similarly equipped Infiniti G35....your point would be better taken.
 
I guess my point is this....its not the lack of features that is the issue because you can have any features you choose, but you didn't choose them on the car you bought.

That's the standard mark-up on BMWs, MBs and now Cadillac. Personally, I don't understand the point of buying a "luxury" car with no luxuries. If I can't afford one loaded, then I'll just wait a year a two and get a low mileage pre-owned version (which is what I plan to do in two years for a CTS).
 
BTW- Brent, my '07 Mazda3 GT has leather (well maybe pleather), heated seats, HIDs, rain sensing wipers, Bose, auto-dim mirror, Homelink and a split folding rear seat for $21k before tax and tags. Guess I'm the one with the luxo ride!!

This is the case with all Mercedes and always has been, it always surprises me that people get surprised by it. To get a fully loaded Benz will always cost at least $4K more than a fully loaded rival, even German rivals.
 
Historically there have always been three main reasons for this:
1) Mercedes wants to think of itself as number one so prices its cars accordingly.
2) Mercedes wants to maintain exclusivity and by pricing at the top you weed out a lot of people.
3) Lastly, there are many unseen aspects of a Mercedes that drive up the cost that most people do not consider. Materials chosen for the structure and safety systems tend to be rather exotic when compared to rivals. Say what you will about electrical quality, few cars look and run as well as a Mercedes after years of hard use.
 
People shopping for value aren't who Mercedes is looking for anyway. That is altogether too practical. Mercedes-Benzes are all about the intagible and the mystique associated with the brand. You buy from the gut not the head, assuming you have the means to do so :)

The age-old MB problem, they're always 20% more than what you'd think they should be, but so far people will pay.

"Say what you will about electrical quality, few cars look and run as well as a Mercedes after years of hard use."
 
mercedesfan- is there any empirical data to back this up? Sounds like a bunch of propoganda to me. If you take care of a car, it will last for the most part. Some guy in the recent news put over a million miles on his Ford Econoline cargo van, now that's how I would define hard use.

Good one, Chavis. I bet your sun roof works too.
 
This MB is a dud in my book. No manual transmission with the big V6, some "sport" sedan.

Infiniti may be the real value story, but often refinement and execution snobs find more value in Audis than they do in Infinitis. Admittedly, Audis do tend to be a step nicer than Audis, nevermind Acuras, and sportier than Lexuses.

To cover Brent, I also want to point out that it does not have the rear audio controls and wireless headsets like the Aura.

Guys....don't you see what's happening here? Everyone who owns something other than a Mercedes is going to look for things that point out "good thing I chose my (insert vehicle owned here) rather than that mercedes piece of garbage".
 
Conversely, those who own Mercedes will look for the good in the reviews / posts to highlight "see...I knew I was right on buying my Mercedes".
 
In the end, it doesn't matter if anyone else agrees with me....I chose a Mercedes and I will either be happy with that decision or not.....it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks.
 
All of these cars are quality vehicles and whichever one you own you are probably happy with that decision. Most differences are a matter of opinion anyway.

Whoa! That entertainment system the IL got is almost three grand. I wonder what percentage of buyers actually order that? I'd probably just get a TomTom and the iPod hookup and call it a day. Then again, I'm cheap.

Nice reality check!
I really don't "get" Mercedes... they have one (if not more) of the WORST JDP rated vehicles in the last 5 years, a record maybe even Hyundai can beat, yet keep up with questionable styling and outrageous prices.
Quality? There has not been a real Mercedes for quite some time. If anyone has spent time in the vault-like built 1990's 300E or 500E, you know what I mean. All of today's Mercedes are shallow comparisons to what made Mercedes name mean something.
 
In my eyes, the C300 (while the best looking C in awhile) offers nothing more than many competitors. It is not the fastest, nor the most comfortable, nor the most luxurious, not close to the best handling... features? nope. Quality? unknown but by sitting in a few of the competitors, I think it's par.
 
There is nothing to suggest the C300 would command a $45,000 price tag (and 'bare bones' at that price!). It's a nice $34,000 car with an ego problem.

As a former Benz fan I think MB nowadays does have a serious problem with their pricing. It used to be (in the 60ies, 70ies and 80ies) that the cars with the 3 pointed star did not have a real rival in their class. Most of the technical innovations came from Mercedes. The first safety cage structures, first crash tests, the first ABS, the first Airbag, the first cars with stability control...those were all introduced in S-Class Benzes and have now found their way into any other car.
 
I used to own a 1983 W123 300 Diesel and up until now I have to say it was one of the most well built cars ever! There was no sign of any cutting corners in that car. Everything was build to last and to function smooth. That approach justified the premium in price because it offered an advantage over any of the competitors (if you were to leave out the Rolls Royce/Bentleys). Just try to find ANY other sedan out of the 80ies on the road today!
 
The problem that Benz has with its C class today (and for whatever its worth, with the two pervious generation models as well) is that they have incorporated cost cutting measures that have diminished the overall quality of their vehicles while other companies have made huge quality improvement leaps. Basically, every car that was introduced by MB from the late eighties on suffered. Take Audi, BMW, Lexus and to a lesser level, Acura and Infiniti. They have not only caught up but even surpassed MB in core areas.
 
This decline is clearly reflected in what cars taxi drivers use in Germany: Not too long ago, Mercedes Benz used to OWN the market for taxis. Every taxi was a Benz. Because it was safe, comfortable and most of all exceptionally robust and reliable. Now their share of the market has dropped below 60%.
 
So, in the end all you get for your extra money, when buying a Benz over any of the competitors is the MB heritage and for Daimler to have the ability (cash) to engage in money losing ventures like Chrysler or formula 1 racing with nothing to show for!

You know, to me value has begun to be attached to individuals features rather than design.
 
For instance, Infiniti is lauded (rightfully, in my eyes) for it's amazing content/price of the G35. Sure, the cupholders are cheap and chintzy...but that's about it.
 
But one of it's main competitors, BMW, offers a few design elements the Infiniti can't be optioned with....slightly better weight distribution. But more than that, the car isn't just better corner balanced, the weight tends to be more towards the middle of the car....meaning it's less likely to lose it's balance. The suspension components utilize more aluminum, meaning they react faster.
 
Sure, Infiniti can match alot of the BMW's performance numbers via it's sport package (skidpad, slalom), or get close, but it does so at the price of ride comfort.
 
So how much value do you attach to the BMW design, which utilizes more centralized mass, slightly better overall weight distribution, and more aluminum? No one talks about that.
 
The same here. The Acura TL came out 4-5 years ago with all of the named features (I believe) missing from this Mercedes Benz...and for around 31-32k when it first came out. So obviously, the Mercedes price point is inflated. What does it offer in design? Well, RWD for one thing.
 
Unfortunately for Mercedes, the new C-Class interior seems to be a design without good execution. The materials are not up to par this time around.
 
As an example: I went to the Philly car show on Day 2. The C300 had tan leather interior...I've never seen such dirty leather. Filthy. Others had gray/light color leather, and looked fine.
 
Other things, like road isolation/feel, are hard to quantify. The new Merc C-class offers more road isolation than the 3-series, but more road feel than the Lexus. A softer ride than the G35.
 
So if you prefer the ride of the Merc, how much is that worth to you?
 
Personally, I want a great 6-speed. And I want an engine that I can drive anyway I please...shift from 1st to 6th if I want, or lounge in 4th for my entire commute.
 
Right now, there is only one mfr that offers that...BMW and it's twin turbo inline six. So though I may not get the value of the G35 or Acura products, I get what I want. How much is that worth?
 
Joe

Joe,
The mere fact you are comparing the C class to cars costing $6,000-$10,000 less means the C class looses.
 
From a value perspective, the C looses. (ie, most other brands)
From a quality perspective, the C looses. (ie, most other brands)
From driving dynamics, the C looses. (ie, most other brands)
 
RWD- Infiniti, Lexus, BMW are all RWD. Audi is 4wd.
 
At least BMW has top notch driving dynamics, which they can ask a premium for.
The fact you talk more about BMW to make your point, tells me that the C class really doesn't have a leg to stand on.

I'm afraid that Cars are like Wives....
 
You might argue that your wife is prettier than my wife.....or that yours is a better cook.....or that she's better in bed. The fact of the matter is that I love my wife despite her flaws and would take her over your wife every day of the week.
 
Said differently....you might argue that your BMW has a better design than my Mercedes.....or that your Audi has better interior materials than my Mercedes.....or that your Infiniti has more horsepower than my Mercedes. The fact of the matter is that I love my Mercedes despite her flaws and would take her over your car every day of the week. :)

Nah...
 
I don't mind to take the BMW, Infiniti, Acura or MB out for a spin but ultimately the one that belongs in my garage will be my IS350.
 
Wait, so you are right, cars are like wives...

Personally, I think the Infiniti is a much better deal.
The most expensive G35 you could get would barely go over $40,000, while the C350 would go over $45,000.
On a random note, I don't remember seeing any blog posts on this car's navigation system...

every MB is a rip off and this is no exception. The truth of the matter is you dont actually get anything on an MB that you cant get elsewhere for less money although I'm sure MB fans will argue otherwise. You pay for the badge and the respect that gets you in certain ciricles, period. There is nothing more behind the price premium associated with a MB product. Other vehicles are just as well made, just as safe, just as quiet and just as advanced.

chavis_10 I don't have info despite what I have seen. After years the leathers, woods, and plastics still look new on my friends 300E and he does not take care of his car at all. The one fact that I do have is that there are over a dozen Mercedes currently on the road with over one million miles on them, the most of any car company in the world.
 
1487 I, not surprisingly, disagree with you. I don't buy into the status associated with Mercedes I just love the cars for their intangible qualities. Also, speaking from a purely litereal mechanical engineering standpoint Mercedes are actually the most advanced cars in the world. Not for the features they offer or their technology, but the way they are put together. There are tons of German mechanics, but very few who will actually work on Benzes because they are so darn complicated.
 
Lastly, what people don't consider is that buying a Mercedes also buys innovation, even if it is not on that particular model. Mercedes is still one of the world's most innovative car companies, you pay for that incredibly expensive R & D with each car.

I used to have an 04 E500, which was for the most part, a nice enough car. It fit my family, it impressed at the country club, and it was fun enough to drive to work.
 
I was even able to overlook the rude and impatient treatment I received at the dealer, and ended up paying over $50k for my car.
 
Sadly enough, it was the most unreliable, unstable car I have EVER owned. I got to know the loaner Camry's I drove just as well as my E500. Fixes were long and stupid, and probably should have been prevented by all of that "incredibly expensive R & D."
 
Unfortunately, I had to unload my car, unable to keep up with the endless repairs.
 
My new 08 Volvo S80 is much more modern and youthful, a far cry from the almost baroque E-class. The interior is innovative and sleek, and comes with ALL of the features one should expect from a modern luxury car.
 
I could order a navigation system as a stand-alone; with Mercedes, a navi is a $2000 option ON TOP OF the $4500 luxury package, which comes with the $850 cold weather pacage, and on and on.
 
Long story short:
 
Mercedes: Regal, imposing, and luxurious, but SERIOUSLY FLAWED, noteably option markups and mechanical reliability.
 
Volvo: Modern, young, and sporty, with a much more buyer-friendly dealer experience, and no problems to date.

norcal75 I actually completely agree with you. I have long said that the 2000-2006 generation cars were inexecusably poorly built, unfortunately they were also the most popular in Mercedes history. Innovation can only go so far when marketing runs the company, and Mercedes engineers allowed that to happen for more than a decade. My only hope is that with Zetsche now at the helm (an engineer himself) the future looks bright, but we will have to wait at least one more model generation to really see the fruits of his labor.
 
My hope is that Mercedes will return to the days of "over-engineered and over-priced" that I remember so fondly.

I have an 1987 Merc 560 SL. 105K miles on it, was used as a daily driver for 10 years, now it's retired to sunny day driving. In the first 105K miles it's required one fuel pump, one water pump and tires and brakes. Otherwise routine fluids. Now that was value. It was expensive new but continued to feel like a new car past it's loan period and it still a great driver. So it saved having to buy a new car for 10 years. On the other hand, my dad bought an 04 E500 and returned it under the lemon law after 12 months.
I think the point of all these threads Honda vs Aura or Merc vs Infiniti is that the gap between all cars has narrowed, with less prestigious brands catching up to the prior standard bearers. It's good for the consumer, now we have more choices, and it's hard to go wrong with anything.

Personally, I just don't see a prospective Mercedes owner going with Infinity just because the car is $6000 cheaper for the same features. Mercedes says "old money" in a way that a G35 or even a BMW never could. And it's not obnoxious and "in your face" as a Bentley might be. I can imagine a Bentley owner buying an Aston. I can imagine an Infinity owner opting instead for a BMW. But I just can't picture a Mercedes owner opting for anything else.

I have to agree with mercedesfan on this one.
  
You might pay more, but feature for feature, the MB is giving you a host of high-tech innovation that you do NOT get on a Saturn, a Mazda, or even the Infiniti G35 for that matter.
  
Case in point - another poster mentioned his car had xenon lights on a Mazda3. They are fixed-position, single mode xenon low-beams.
  
The C-Class' optional lights are bi-xenon, adaptive (based on speed, wheel position, and ESC inputs) with dynamic level control, heated high-pressure washers, and separate corner-illuminating fog lights for low speed, tight turns. Newly introduced on some MB's is a multi-mode program that adapts the light pattern to optimize visibility on country roads, highways, rain, and city driving.
  
You can't simply compare one xenon light option to another when they are substantially different. If you don't care about those features, then don't buy a Mercedes because it's not the car for you. BMW, Mercedes, and Audi focus on advanced features and a unique driving experience. They are NOT marketing their cars to provide you with maximum value. Why is that so difficult for many to accept or understand?

bimmerjay- relax, I wasn't saying my car is as advanced as the C class. Just making the point that much cheaper cars are offering similar features as top brand luxury models. In this case, a Mazda3 GT has an MSRP of around $23k with moonroof/bose pckg and is loaded with way more equipment than IL's C-class. It has a 5dps auto w/man mode, traction/stability control a trip computer and plenty of other features SIMILAR to a C's. I'm not trying to boast on my car, just illustrating a point. People tend to react to the tangible items they can see and interact with so it's pretty hard for the OBJECTIVE person to be smitten on the promise of superior design when they notice the cheaper competition (ie G35) offers a lot more for less money. It'll take you a half hour to explain to the average buyer why the C300 cost so much but offers so little. I guarantee that if they care more about their monthly payment as opposed to the 3 pointed star, they'll look elsewhere. However, the C class does have the advantage because it's at the bottom of the MB model line where the trickle down effect pays the most dividends. Obviously, a $150k S600 will bequeath certain features to the lowly C class a couple years down the road.
  
Also, to correct you- Mazda's HID system is manually adjustable for 3 levels. The Euro system also features high pressure jet washers but wasn't exported for cost reasons. The multi-mode headlamp system you mention in the refreshed SL hasn't passed USA regulations yet. It may or may not be included in our version of the vehicle. MB attempted to bring this tech over during the last E class refresh but it was rejected as being to distracting to oncoming traffic.
  
"hey are NOT marketing their cars to provide you with maximum value. Why is that so difficult for many to accept or understand?"
  
Well that is stating the obvious. My stance is that those who purchase the cheaper alternative (ie G35) should not be told their car is inferior simply because it was not manufactured by MB. I will be acquiring a slightly used car in this class in a few years and the 3 series nor the C class will not be on the list because they are poor values. The average driver of these vehicles will not be able to appreciate the supposed intrinsic qualities of these vehicles in our traffic plagued world and that's simply a fact. I am convinced that the majority of people who buy these vehicles have brand recognition above all else on their list of criteria. I work in downtown Philly and see countless 3s with sport packages tooling around dodging the same pot holes as your average Corolla/Civic in 10 mph gridlock- most yapping on the phone. Unless these drivers are escaping to the mountains an hour and a half north of the city, they're pretty much wasting all that pedigree DNA. Me, I'll take more features and warm inviting interiors any day since I expect to use my car in the real world. Granted, maybe some of you share the daily routine of these auto editors and just take week long trips on sinuous mountain roads with no destination, but that ain't the majority of people buying 335s.

My perception of Mercedes is a company that has bought into costcutting and skimping on quality, riding the coattails of the glory days. That sounds really harsh but the image Mercedes has built in the last 10 years is exactly that.
 
I will gladly pay $6K more if it is built better or offers something (anything) that stands above the others. You know, like Mercedes used to do??
You don't need bi-xenon flux capacitors. You simply build a vault that lasts forever- the MB way. People pay and love it. Simple formula Mercedes used to live by.
The C, while very nice indeed, is no more special in any way over the competition.
Reading over the long-term log, the experience doesn't seem very good either.
 
 Justify the premium price by producing a premium product.
So far Mercedes has 50% of that equation right; now to fill in the 50% that benefits the customer...

Good points, chavis10. FYI, the manual HID level adjustment is common to cars with dynamic leveling as well - it's still the best way to calibrate for each market at the factory, as I learned on my tour of the BMW plant in Munich.
 
There are definitely those people who are badge buyers versus those who are buying for the tech + driving experience. FWIW, I have a 335i coupe (with the sport package, of course) that I make my very short commute with. But living in the SF Bay Area also means I have beautiful winding mountain roads at my disposal for the weekend, so I guess that doesn't put me in the majority. :-)

"I think the point of all these threads Honda vs Aura or Merc vs Infiniti is that the gap between all cars has narrowed, with less prestigious brands catching up to the prior standard bearers. It's good for the consumer, now we have more choices, and it's hard to go wrong with anything."
 
Thank you.
 
This nonsense about MB models being better engineered and more advanced is absurd. Lexus, Cadillac, Audi and BMW are all offering cars with excellent build quality and state of the art techonology. CAdillac has been innovatign and getting patents for decades JUST like MB. MB doesn't have the market cornered on technology by any means and feature for feature MB vehicles are some of the most overpriced on the market. The MB advantage at the end of the day comes down to prestige and little more. If you can afford a MB more power to you but lets not be fooled into believing MB has come mystique and engineering prowess that cant be valued. EVERYTHING when it comes to cars can be valued. I'm not impressed enough with the 3 pointed star emblem to pay a $5k premium for it over other cars.

Have you guys that are talking about "value" of the C vs other cars, actually gone to the websites and compared MSRPs for similarly optioned cars?
 
An automatic 335i, lightly optioned, is pushing over 45k and quickly climbs to the 50k mark. The new STI, with minimal options, 37k. If you don't go for the multimedia system the C350 is 42k. A4, lightly optioned 40k (I hope nobody's stupid enough to actually pay that for the last year of production before the new one hits).
 
I paid 37k for my C300 (I'll admit I paid 'gotta have it tax' ... no dealer in 3 states would part with one under msrp) and yes, it has heated seats. Unless Edmunds really got their C300 without P1, which I find hard to believe, yes it has heated seats.
 
I'm the first to admit after having it for a few months that there are obvious cost cutting measures. Nothing has that solid feel that my previous 3 series' had. But, where the C does excel is being a better rounded every day car. The ride / handling balance is perfect for me. Where my RFT equipped 3 series was harsh over sharp impacts, the C shrugs it off. Where the C gives up steering feel, it still has plenty of grip and it doesn't feel like it's always trying too hard to go fast like the 3. That's hard to describe, but my wife summed it up best when she said, 'even when you're going around corners fast, my head isn't whipping around like in your BMWs'.
 
As for the "value" arguement ... if you really want to pursue that, there isn't any car in this segment that has something the others don't. In fact, none of these cars really offer features or safety that cars two classes lower don't have, except performance and brand name. There isn't any *correct* choice, it's all a matter of taste. Conversely, there aren't any dogs in this segment either. With the caveat that you have to be comfortable paying the price; if you have 50k that you can spend, it's a lot harder to convince yourself that the 25k car is just as good. But if you only have 25k to spend, it's much easier to convince yourself that it's just as good as the 50k car.
 
I do agree that you're paying more of the C's price for the name though. But it's still feels like a good car to me. That said, I don't think I'd ever purchase any of the cars in this category. They all change/one-up each other so fast that it's a better bet to lease. But that's me rambling.

PS. the P1 package has homelink and dimming mirrors too.

Does this car get driven at all?

We actually own this car, black on black on the stock 17's opted for the panoramic sunroof and the p1&p2 as well as the 6 disc changer and the 7speed(that they make you pay for. . .) It makes sense that there isn't much value in the benz... You can get a nav and a hdd on a lancer and you did...I personally don't agree with the options chosen on the long termer.
 
      I had been waiting for the car to come out for a while and i think the dual exhaust tips look tough and it makes a pretty good noise when you stomp on the loud pedal. Having said that and admitting to having one there are some things to consider. Mechanically there is nothing wrong with the car but the trunk is small and the storage up front leaves something to be desired... I still love my benz I wouldn't have purchased any other car. To me choosing this sport sedan over the 3 series or the a4 came down to passion... for some inexplicable(read 3pointedstar) reason I wanted to see the car in my driveway, and there it sits until i get up for work.
 
p.s I promise future posts will make more sense it's kind of late.

There's nothing wrong with buying a C or 3, just as long as its feature content matches the prestige of the name plate. My only beef is when ppl try to justify a base model entry luxury model as being superior to a loaded cheaper car. Sure, a car like the CTS is fundamentally better than your average $25k sedan, but if I get inside and see vinyl seats, no wood, no pop-up nav etc, what's really the point? For example, my neighbor has a purple '08 CTS base model with just about no options and ugly 17" base rims. However, since it's a cadillac everyone gets excited when in fact their Accord or Camry might have more features and ameneties. When I step up into the luxury car world I don't want any compromises, otherwise I might as well stick with the Mazdas, Saturns, Hondas & Toyotas.

"if you have 50k that you can spend, it's a lot harder to convince yourself that the 25k car is just as good. But if you only have 25k to spend, it's much easier to convince yourself that it's just as good as the 50k car."
 
Well said. I would also add that part of the alure of the $50k car is that it is reserved for those that can afford it. Choosing between three different $50k cars rarely comes down to a value decision....its about feel, status, personal taste, etc.

Almost every C-Class sold has the Premium I package ($1,400) would provide many of the features one would expect on a luxury car. It comes with rain sensing wipers, Sirius sat radio, auto-dimming mirrors, power folding side mirrors, heated front seats, and a garage door opener. I'm not sure why the C-Class that InsideLine bought doesn't have the Premium I package, that is very unusal.