2002 BMW M3: Can I Keep It?

Stiff heavy clutch pedal is so old school in the modern days of DSG......

"Stiff heavy clutch pedal is so old school in the modern days of DSG......"
 
Not for sports cars it isn't.

I think I'll buy Donna some reuseable grocery bags. All those plastic ones make me sad.

Donna, did the stiff clutch cause issues while you were stuck in traffic? My 2003 Mazda6 wears me out in stop-and-go, but I can't imagine it's anywhere near as stiff as the M3's.
 
I have to agree with both estreka and jriz. Jriz, maybe you and I can send her a care package.

No, the clutch didn't bother me in traffic. It might it I were stuck for a long time, though.

"I think I'll buy Donna some reuseable grocery bags. All those plastic ones make me sad."
 
Maybe they have them recycled into the giant water bottles that they are always trying to fit into the cup holders.

the anti plastic bag people are probably the ones that complained about paper bags because we were killing trees

I don't think M3 drivers care about paper or plastic. It's not like I'm blogging about the Prius and wearing a fur coat.
 
I did, however, shop at Sprouts, which only sells organic food. And they gave me the plastic bags.
 
Now, how about that M3?

glad to see the M3 doing some errands. :) Don't see that too often.

there you have a BMW M3 in front of you and all that you talk is the grocery bags? What is this, a Martha Stewart blog?
 
Apart from the GPS, have you noticed anything else that looks outdated?

LMAO at tmanz!

Hey Donna,
 
Thanks for a great post and pictures...always important to see some day-to-day practicality pictures (much like pictures of the inside with all of your things in it...cell phone, ipod, drink of choice, assorted ID badges, etc.).
 
I just wanted to provide a brief update. I'm a BMWCCA member and receive this publication, Roundel. Whilst reading it, one of the "tech talk" sections described the engine failure of early M3's, and the cause of it.
 
According to Roundel's resident BMW junkie, the engine failures were caused by a combination of two things: A redline mandated by marketing and not engineers...i.e. marketing said the car had to redline at 8000rpms for sales purposes, engineers said otherwise....as well a combination of a too-thin oil.
 
The engine "reflash" given by dealerships was supposed to lower the redline/fuel cutoff to 7900 rpms or less, and BMW M said that all M3 3.2 liter engines of that generation receive 10w60 oil.
 
A piece of anecdote I didn't realize is that the Z3 M Coupe/Roadster of 2001/2002 did not have an 8000 rpm redline...it had a 7600 rpm redline, thereby dictating it's 315 HP rating.
 
Obviously, this car needs to be taken care of properly if taken to redline regularly....i.e. a heavy-arse oil.
 
Hope this helps explain the engine failures a little bit better.
 
Tangent: My 06 Civic SI has a redline of 8000 and a fuel cutoff of ~8300. The other day, I floored it on wet road with an ambient temp of 40 F. The wheelspin happened so fast that the engine spun to ~8400 rpms before I could stop it. Eek.
 
Joe

The thing about the S54s in the M Coupe/Roadster is that while they have a lower redline, they also still detonate just like the early M3s. So I don't necessarily buy the RPM theory.
 
There are a couple of guys in the MZ3 world who do preventative maintenance on those engines. I guess they replace the crankshaft and pistons with some sort of aftermarket units? Supposedly BMW changed those components as well on the later S54s which is why later M3s and Z4 M Coupes don't have this problem.
 
Oh and btw, the RPM difference on the M Coupe/Roadsters was only one factor in the HP reduction. The exhaust and intake packaging had an effect as well, which is why the 315hp version dynos lower HP than the 333hp version throughout the rev range, not just in those last 400 missing RPM.

BMW M3 is one of the top 10 most enjoyable, attainable, daily drivable cars in the last 10 years and the reaction to a photo of it is "Plastic bags make me sad".........I can't properly express how wrong that comment is without violating the TOS.
Anyone bothered so much by plastic bags should not be driving a car, using a computer, consuming electricity, or any other offensiv, environmentally unfriendly activity.

"Not for sports cars it isn't."
 
So you are saying all modern F1 race cars, the Ferrari Enzo, the Bugatti Veyron and the Nissan GTR are not real sports car? None of them have a clutch pedal.

i only re commented on the bags because well. outside of the old school radio, this car is still near perfection. so can I drive it?

"Not for sports cars it isn't."
  
So you are saying all modern F1 race cars, the Ferrari Enzo, the Bugatti Veyron and the Nissan GTR are not real sports car? None of them have a clutch pedal."
 
But if they did they'd have nice heavy clutch pedals. None of this ultra-light no-feel crap.

I love how the qualification for real sports car keeps getting tougher and tougher...
 
First it was suppose to be fast, then it has to handle good, later it becomes manual only and now it is "must have nice heavy clutch pedals, none of this ultra-light no-feel crap". By the trend we are going, sooner it'll be like: It's not a real sports car because it has the wrong badge.

"By the trend we are going, sooner it'll be like: It's not a real sports car because it has the wrong badge."
 
It is more like, it is not a real sports car because it is not how I want it to be, nothing else matters.

If I recall correctly, the exploding M3 engines suffered a bottom end failure - crankshaft/bearings overheating, basically 'puking' out the guts as the TSB evidently termed it. This seems more like an overall structural weakness or bearing durability issue, rather than a redline problem -especially a 7600 vs 7900 vs 8000 redline. The internal heat and wear forces just couldn't be that much different.
 
Wouldn't an over-revved engine instead have a head/valve failure due to float, possibly sending part of a broken valve through a piston? It wouldn't puke out its guts, it would just give you a few loud bangs and spew oil and antifreeze out the tailpipe. Sort of a nascar(DEI)-style cloud of white smoke.
 
I dunno, I guess either situation sucks.

"If I recall correctly, the exploding M3 engines suffered a bottom end failure - crankshaft/bearings overheating, basically 'puking' out the guts as the TSB evidently termed it. This seems more like an overall structural weakness or bearing durability issue, rather than a redline problem -especially a 7600 vs 7900 vs 8000 redline. The internal heat and wear forces just couldn't be that much different.
  
Wouldn't an over-revved engine instead have a head/valve failure due to float, possibly sending part of a broken valve through a piston? It wouldn't puke out its guts, it would just give you a few loud bangs and spew oil and antifreeze out the tailpipe. Sort of a nascar(DEI)-style cloud of white smoke.
  
I dunno, I guess either situation sucks."
 
Anyway you look at it, it is simply very poor engineering, on a suppose to be world class sports car.

"Tangent: My 06 Civic SI has a redline of 8000 and a fuel cutoff of ~8300. The other day, I floored it on wet road with an ambient temp of 40 F. The wheelspin happened so fast that the engine spun to ~8400 rpms before I could stop it. Eek."
 
Nothing to worry about Joe as the K20 you have in your Si is good for 8600RPM! After that serious oiling issues occur.

Just curious but does anyone know how much it would cost if the engine let go?
 
Oh and by the way.... all true sports cars have clutches. The trick boxes are only there so the posers can drive one too. Car makers aren't dumb, they know the image crowd often has more money then the true car guys and they want a piece of it.

"Just curious but does anyone know how much it would cost if the engine let go?"
 
My guess, if you source a new engine from BMW, and get no warranty help, and have it installed at a dealer... $17-$18k?
 
If you get a used motor and install it yourself, maybe $6k?
 
"Oh and by the way.... all true sports cars have clutches." Clutch pedals, you mean. And I wholeheartedly agree with you. An automatic is an automatic, no matter what acronyms you use, how fast it shifts, or where you mount the paddles.

For a long time, automatics were inferior to manual transmission in so many ways. They still are, in some ways, but in cases such as the DSG, it's hard to fight it's ability to consistently shift faster than humanly possible. It's main downside is that it's a complex, expensive system requiring more regular maintenance and a standard manual transmission and probably has a shorter lifespan (still too early to tell). It also has some torque restrictions.
 
A sports car is all about feel. No amount of horsepower, or driven wheels, or any other single metric makes a sports car. I would wager against calling the Bugatti Veyron a sports car...it's a supercar. From what I've read, it's an extremely heavy car with very little feel but can do amazing feats. A sports car is more of a car that can do amazing things with an amazing driver.
 
A car that rewards skills with ever increasing feats for itself, not in comparison with others.
 
That is why an old Porsche 911 with it's tendency to pendulum, is considered a sports car. It's not that impressive in a modern setting, but it does amazing things considering it's design. In the hands of a skilled driver.
 
Joe

"It's main downside is that it's a complex, expensive system requiring more regular maintenance and a standard manual transmission and probably has a shorter lifespan (still too early to tell). It also has some torque restrictions. "
 
Torque restrictions? The Bugatti Veyron got a DSG, the stock engine put out 923 lb-ft @ 2200 rpm, and the tranny is rated at 2000 lb-ft. That is not enough torque capacity for you?

"That is not enough torque capacity for you?"
 
That only proves that if you spend enough money, you can get anything to work.