2007 Saturn Aura: Please End the Pedal Madness

Our SRX, Silverado and especially the Tahoe all suffer from the same problem, but it's disappointing that a sedan with sporting aspirations does as well. The Audi Q7 also does, so I guess it's not entirely restricted to the General.

it's the same way with my pontiac vibe and makes my commute uncomfortable after awhile (in addictino to the lack of rearward seat travel for the driver seat and non-telescoping wheel). even though pontiac is a gm company, the vibe is basically a toyota matrix with a nicer (imo) exterior. so just more proof that this gas-brake-pedal-plane-misalignment isn't restricted to GM.

Can somebody post (or direct me to) a picture of a car in which this is not the case? I own an '02 Chevy Malibu and my step-father worked at GM, so I guess that most of the cars I've driven have been GM products. Still, my girlfriend has an '06 Altima and I've never noticed that the pedals are arranged differently in my car than in hers.

never noticed this on any car I've driven. I would assume its not a major issue to most drivers.

Obviously, there's some variation in pedal alignment in most cars. However, GM's Epsilon sedans are the only ones I've driven that require me to readjust the seat to accommodate the wonky pedal arrangement. I don't have to do this in our L-T Camry or our L-T Altima, and this makes the Aura less inviting.
 
Perhaps this complaint is unique to my physiology, but airing one's opinions inevitably involves some risk, doesn't it?

I just know that in my Cooper and BMW the brake is set next to the gas in such a way that you can roll your foot so you're braking and hitting the gas all at once. Pretty natural, easy motion I try to do often to encourage downshifts before entering a corner.

But if they're on the same plane, the drivers will get confused and accelerate into things when they start up the car, or when they're at farmers' markets. It's for your own protection!

Please be joking.

Here's a story of two Mustangs. One had an automatic and presented a similar different-pedal-height problem as described above. The other had a manual, with the brake and accelerator in roughly the same plane. My thought is that this is indeed a safety issue. When I brake in the manual Mustang, I apparently sometimes do not move my foot over far enough and find myself revving the engine while braking. Not a problem because I've got the clutch pedal to the floor too, and therefore the engine isn't fighting with the brakes. However in an automatic where there is no way to disengage the transmission from the engine, if both pedals were to be in the same plane, you could at least theoretically be accidentally hitting both pedals at the same time, thus reducing/negating stopping performance. To have the brake pedal higher is an "idiot proof" way to avoid this.

carlisimo: Come to think of it, my pedestrian casualty count has been low since I started driving the Aura. Well... now I know why. ;)

I hope the author knows the Aura has adjustable pedals. If not, maybe the author should learn his vehicles before driving one. I have an Aura XR with the adjustable pedals, short wife. I just wish the seats had a memory position, because I have to adjust not just the pedals, but the seat as well. Oh well, really can't complain too much.

aurakr: Adjusting the pedals (as a unit) doesn't help -- it's the difference between the pedal heights and the gas pedal upper right-hand corner location that I find problematic.
 
Thanks for the driving advice. Next time I'll check with you before getting behind the wheel. --Erin Riches

ERiches. Sorry, I just reread your message. I have driven GM products for oh 24 years, and never had your problem. Per some of my coworkers, because I have driven GM products, I wouldn't know what a good vehicle is, ie Toyota or Nissan, anything Japanese in their eyes.
 
Maybe because I have size 12 feet, I never noticed the difference. I will quiz my wife upon waking from her nap, and ask her if she has noticed any problem with the pedals. So far from what I have read, this appears to be a problem for you. However, since you are writing the review, a problem for you is now a problem for Saturn, regardless how good the vehicle is otherwise. How many other editors will be driving the vehicle? If 10 other editors are driving the vehicle, don't have your problem with the pedals, maybe they get to give 90 percent of the review.

I just checked both my vehicles. My S (a manual) is on the same plane (roughly). My '99 Silverado (an auto) is not. Never noticed it to be honest, but I know exactly what you're talking about. Driving other ppl's vehicles, I tend to be nitpicky about stuff like that (I sit pretty far forward anyway).

I noticed pedal height difference when I drove my friend's Rabbit, and it annoyed the heck out of me.
I don't know how I never noticed before, when I test drove the Rabbit last year. But then I test drove manual, not auto like my friend's.
 
Maybe some of you GM guys should lay off bickering at the reviewer. Pedal height thing is important as well as personal preference issue. I like my pedals on same plane. Easier for my foot transition and less likely to get my foot stuck behind pedals unintended.

If you remember, I blogged about the pedal-plane-problem in my Tahoe blog. <http://66.160.188.111/roadtests/1256>
      
It seems like a trivial thing until the first time the inside corner of your right foot gets snagged on the brake as you lift off of the gas.

mohaji, are you saying those folks work for GM? :o)

aurakr, this is NOT a vehicle REVIEW as you keep calling it, it is a BLOG about a vehiclesthat is in the edmunds.com long term test fleet. This BLOG is informative because it points out things that otherwise may not be captured in a regular Road Test, whether it be from Edmunds.com, C/D, Motor Trend, etc. Just as other blogs here have pointed out positive Aura attributes, this one points out one that is a negative, for this editor and for some of the owners and enthusiasts that have commented. Same goes for the rest of the L-T fleet...........

Alpha01
 
Yes it is a blog. However it is a long term test(review) of a vehicle.
Last time I knew, people reading this blog will see how the writer review(evaluates) the car. ERiches has an issue with the pedal placement on the Epsilon platform. Readers will read that and also see that she has never had that problem with a Camry or Altima. Many will therefore infer the Camry or Altima are better for everyone, not just her.
 
I would just like to hear from the other editors driving the car to see how they feel. As I have stated before, I have driven GM vehicles for 24 years and never once had this problem. I also have driven Fords, Toyotas, Hondas, Dodges, Chryslers, and never had this problem with any vehicle.
 
As stated in the initial review of the Aura, I got the impression someone didn't feel it deserved Car of the Year. Each to his own, but I would like to have prior Camry/Accord/Altima editors acknowledge what vehicles they have prior to again that word, reviewing a vehicle. Especially a vehicle in competition with them. I'll freely admit I wish the Aura sold more. I'll wager a bet GM wishes it sold better too.
 
It seems in this day and age, it would be nice to know what type of personal car each blogger(reviewer) has to get a feel for their biases in vehicles.
 
FWIW, I drive a 2007 Aura XR, 2006 Chevrolet Impala LS. I have never denied I am an American car supporter, much to the dismay of many of my coworkers. The Toyota fanatics are really annoying these days.

I hope the author knows the Aura has adjustable pedals. If not, maybe the author should learn his vehicles before driving one.
—aurakr
  
Thanks for the driving advice. Next time I'll check with you before getting behind the wheel.
—eriches
  
Well, that's a tad flippant. I'll respond in kind. I don't remember if you've done so, but I know some Edmunds personnel have bellyached about not being able to figure out some feature without checking the owner's manual. RTFM, please. (Yes, I realize the manual is not relevant to this blog entry. My request is meant generally.)

I suppose it's a valid complaint, but I actually come from the other side of the fence; I grew up with GM vehicles, so to me the brake/gas pedal always seemed to naturally co-exist on two separate planes. That's how I knew which was which. You always had to pick up your foot to brake, and that made sense to me.
 
I also tend to like a stiff brake pedal with a long travel, and GM vehicles usually oblige.
 
So when I started test-driving other cars, like BMWs for instance, with the pedals at the same height, the brake/gas pedals felt unnatural and almost dangerous, like one continuous pedal surface.
 
Of course when I started to learn heel-and-toe, having the pedals at the same height made a world of difference. I haven't driven a GM car yet with a manual transmission, so that might be a deal-breaker to some.
 
Anyway I'm just letting you know, I think it's more about what you're used to and less about which is the better solution.

Excellent point about heel-toe braking/downshifting, ddsurace! A pedal setup with the brake pedal measurably higher than the go pedal is never conducive to heel-toeing.
 
The car may have a slushbox, but for those who are accustomed to heel-toeing, they may prefer a pedal arrangement where they can angle their right foot counter-clockwise a little to simply brake with the ball of their right foot. If the brake pedal is so high that a person needs to lift his or her right foot to hit the binders, I can see how that would be uncomfortable for that person.

A note to aurakr:
 
This is one logbook entry out of six so far. Each of those six was written by a different Edmunds staffer. They've had the car for one month--with about eleven months to go, I think you can count on getting plenty of other viewpoints.
 
What you've done is the equivalent of complaining about a whole meal when all you've received so far is the beverage. So relax.

Stephen987:
 
I am relaxed. But thank you for your concern. However if a waiter messes up my beverage order, I usually become quite curious as to outcome for the rest of the dinner. In this case, I'll admit I am slightly concerned. Why, well when Consumer Reports can get away with out and out Pro-Japanese bias in reviewing the new Tundra versus the new Silverado, I worry about bias here at Edmunds. I have given up on Honda/BMW and Driver. That is why I let my subscription lapse.
 
In this day and age when it seems many Americans? want the domestic automakers to disappear, I worry about blogs(reviews)
doing stuff. That is why I would like to hear what type of vehicles each editor owns. Just curious.
 
BTW, I spoke with the wife and she said she doesn't have a problem with the pedals on the XR. For those persons trying to heel and toe in an automatic, she said get a life. Gotta love her. Might explain her driving a minivan though.

"For those persons trying to heel and toe in an automatic, she said get a life."
 
LOL! Quote of the day! I don't know anyone who tries to do that. I know for me personally, I just would like to be able to brake in the same manner on a slushbox-equipped vehicle as I do in my 'Rex--just rotate my right foot slightly counter-clockwise and initially apply pressure to the brake pedal through the ball of my right foot. Is that asking too much? I don't think so.

aurakr, calm down fella. I'm also a big GM fan, and I also occasionally read things here that sound a bit biased. Lately I've noticed a bit of an attempt to tone that down (only somewhat successfully however). In any case, Erin's comments about the pedals is NOT in the category of biased reviews and comments. I've posted about this same annoyance in several of our own GM vehicles. We had a 2004 Malibu, and it was exactly as Erin says- awkward, and made finding the right position a bit of a chore. The same thing applied for the 2004 Silverado and now my 2007 Avalanche. GM for some reason likes to do this with the pedals.
 
And no, the adjustable pedals don't help. Raise 'em up or lower 'em down, the throttle is still lower than the brake pedal by the same distance, as well as a bit higher (2 o'clock high, maybe). I very much like all three of the vehicles I listed with this issue above, but that doesn't mean that I should stick my head in the sand and pretend that this isn't an annoyance and blindly defend these vehicles against valid criticisms.

As stated before, I am relaxed and calm. At least my doctor says my blood pressure is normal. So far so good. Again, I stated that I never noticed the pedal problem. I do not blindly defend against valid criticisms and I'll prove it. The biggest problem with this vehicle, and I do love driving it, is the lack of dual climate control. I sincerely hope the new Epsilon 2 will correct this obvious oversight. That would be a valid criticism. I would agree with it.
 
My work offers me the ability to drive numerous different types and different makes of vehicles and I have never noticed the pedal issue. Again, it could be because I have size 12 feet. I don't know. Sure hasn't stopped me in the past from putting my foot in my mouth, per the wife.

When i drive my bros corolla, I have to do it without shoes because the pedals are so close!! My Size 13 shoes just dont fit. My accord, No problem at all. Neither is it in my moms miata or dads expedition.
 
-Cj

I agree about the lack of dual zone climate control in the Epsilons, aurakr. Though the existance of the automatic climate control in the Malibu's as an option since the 2004 redesign while still not being available in the Impala (regardless of dual zone or not) seems to be a bit strange too.

GM reserves dual zone auto AC for higher end cars. Not sure why, but to me its not an issue. As long as its automatic I am happy. This car needs two things, rear armrest and grab handles for passengers. It's not getting them for 2008 although they are fixing the center armrest issue.