2007 Mini Cooper S: Run-Flat Tires

Interesting point. The cars I drove at the First Drive in Spain had black-painted ones.

Run flats are just bad on all counts. I hate them!
 
elbee, I just looked at a 2003 Mini Cooper and it has similar rear suspension arms.

$300 for a single 17" tire?!? That really hurts; even the (awesome) 22/545R18 Potenza RE050 Pole Position tires on my RX-8 are 1/3 less expensive. There's no way I would get run-flats with prices like that.

"elbee, I just looked at a 2003 Mini Cooper and it has similar rear suspension arms."
 
where?
 
http://www.mini2.com/images/news/gptuning/33_8114.jpg

Since there wasn't a place to comment on the into article for this car, I will do it here.
 
How about, just for once, recognizing that large portions of the country live in areas where heavy traffic is a fact of life, and specing the sporty car with an auto.
 
Everyone please spare me the comments about manual is the only way to go with a sports car or sedan (and feel free to tell Ferarri to stop producing grandma cars and ditch the DSG trannies). I have owned over a dozen manual equiped cars including a '71MGBGT, an '87 Mustang LX 5.0, and a 91 Sentra SE-R. I have driven manual BMW's and 911's. I understand how much fun a good manual can be on a winding road.
 
But I live in an area where travelling 12 miles can take an hour. I get an open winding country road 2 or 3 times a year, and I am not an aberration. This is the norm for most urban dwellers.
 
I'm not saying that the majority of reveiws should be auto boxes, but throw the urban drivers a bone once in a while. How about a comparo, GTI, WRX, Mini Cooper S. Call it Urban Sports Sedan

I wish the picture with the Cooper raised had shown the exhaust too cause I really think it looks awful compared with the previous S version.
This link has shows what I mean (just looks tacky).
http://autos.yahoo.com/mini_cooper_s-slideshow/?tab=gen&i=izp_rearview#imgs

The big issue I have with my 07 Cooper S:
 
Run flat tires.
 
I look forward to eventually replacing them with real tires. This made a huge difference on my 06 330i and I'm sure it'll make the Cooper S a better handling/riding car too.
 
BTW, have you guys attempted to use the HVAC without the AC? If I turn on the HVAC set to cold but without AC the blasted thing churns out hot air as if it were a furnace vent. Does this happen on all Mini Coopers?

Not sure. Have not checked that BG.

Traffic doesn't keep us from getting stickshifts =].

That plug will hold. It's still on the tread surface, a bit from the sidewall plus the runflats have really hard sidewalls = minimal flex.
I am surprised that the 07 Minis still have the crappy warning light low tyre pressure system. This is also in use in my 06 BMW. Domestic mfgs for a few years now have systems that show the actual pressure per tyre, so no crawling around figuring out which tyre is low.

I agree with bankerdanny. There are way too many long term cars with manual transmissions. Even in cars where it would make sense to get the auto like the CVT in the Versa that gets better mileage than the stick.

I can understand the point about testing a sporty auto, but . . . .When I dream of buying something like a Mini Cooper S, I dream in manual, despite living in southwest Crook County (as in Chicagoland). I just don't think I would have this car any other way, so I'll admit it's nice to read reviews of the car I would likely buy.
 
Back to tires, I have heard nothing but bad things about runflats. Is this a case of a vocal minority? Does anyone like these things? It's enough to make me avoid any car equipped with them.

Gotta chime in and agree with bankerdanny here too. Like it or not, America is where manuals go to die. Nearly everyone opts for an auto these days and it would be nice to see a car like this tested with an auto. The majority of these that I see driving around are driven by hip mid 30s gals and guys, and I've yet to see one outfitted with a stick. Maybe Edmunds could get a VW GTI with the DSG transmission to appease the rest of us? : )

I agree with desmolicious. This plug will probably hold for a very long time. I have been plugging my own tires (with auto part store kits) for over twenty years and I've never had one even leak, much less fail. I've had plugged tires go for 20-30,000 miles and never leak. Anyway, what's the worst that could happen - another slow leak?
  
The stock answer is new tire - there's a lot more profit in a new tire than in a ten dollar repair.

Not so fast, Desmo. This is an actual pressure measuring system. BMW is changing over from the ABS sensor Low Tire Monitor to the direct-sensing Tire Pressure Monitor. New USA regulations (FMVSS 138) require accuracy beyond the capability of the traditional ABS type. Direct measurement systems don't have to display the pressures (cost, dash space), they just have to illuminate a lamp.
  
But for some reason the '07 Mini still has a reset button. The 2007 Toyota Camry TPMS system is another example of direct-acting with a reset button. Some TPMS suppliers persist with the reset button with a direct measurement type, even though it is technically possible to do without. Perhaps those carmakers that sold a lot of ABS-based systems in the past (BMW, Toyota) got used to the reset button and don't want to go without on their direct systems.

I find the reset button useful to those of us running non-standard pressures. With a direct system having a reset button allows for an alert when a tire drops to 25% below the user-defined default rather than that specified by the manufacturer. However, I would still prefer an exact reading of pressure for each tire.

I don't get it... I get a screw stuck in the middle of the tread on my RFT and the innumerable places I called refused to patch the tire. Granted it's written on the tire ("do not repair/patch") and in the owner's manual... but most places said "no" before I even told them what kind of car or tire I had. How did you guys get a patch so easily??

O.K. all you have to realize something. Firstly the type of transmission that people will choose will vary depending on what part of the country you live in. We happen to sell mostly manual trabsmission MINI's since that what about 80 percent of our customers ask for. We are in the Northeast New England Area (Tri State CT/NY/NJ). Believe it or not in spite of our traffic situations we still don't sell many Automatic transmission MINI's of any model. The key is that you all are right. No one is wrong. If you look at the statistics though most MINI owners men or women motor with a manual transmission. I see someone also wondered why MINI Dealers will not plug run flat tires. You compromise the run flat ability of the tire when you plug it because what if it did go flat? How many miles did you run on it while it was flat??? If you plug it and it goes flat again how many miles do you have until the tire shreds apart? It would be a huge nightmare if dealers were to start doing this. I don't blame MINI for not wanting the liability. By the way Inside Line very importantly because of the simplicity of the type of Tire Pressure Monitoring system that MINI uses that only alerts you when a tire loses air pressure is the reason why it doesn't reset itself. It's not the type of system that goes beyond alerting the driver when one of the tires loses air pressure. 2008 Modle Year will see the use of the more advanced type of TPM system that will actually tell you what tire has lost air an the pressure in each of the tires.

I've never used runflats myself, and with $300 price tags, I doubt I ever will. I bought my Falken Ziex ZE512s (255/40/17) for $120 apiece (they're the best tires EVER). For a Mini, I'd probably buy a set of Hankooks or even Fuzions (surprisingly good tires for sub-$100 pricetag).
 
Runflats are overrated. If you have roadside assistance, runflats are pretty worthless. The argument I always get is "well, what if you're in a rough neighborhood?" Seriously, how many rough neighborhoods do you drive through to get to work? Actually, with runflats, you may have to because you can't drive on the highways with that 55mph limit on punctured runflats.

I had a 2003 Mini Cooper S.Changed the run flats to Toyo Proxies and it drove smoother and handled better...
 
I did get a flat going to Vegas. Roadside assistance fixed me up no problem. Towed to next garage and got it patched.
They had tire in stock with same size but didnt need it.
 
I would have gotten AAA after roadsite assitance ran out.
 
Sold the car (in 1 Day!) for a Audi S4 with 343 BHP...I wish I didn't!!!
Miss the MINI! I drive a fast pig now..can't wait for lease to finish.
 
New MINI is uglier..I hate the front and rear...the exhaust looks horrible from back and the front looks like its raised like 4X4.
 
I will get low milaege MINI pre 2007 for sure.

Maybe its only rural midwesterners that will patch tires. I have yet to ever see a shop out here in the sticks refuse to patch a tire runflat or not. I also know of many places that, get this, still sell innertubes for the tires that cannot be patched! Now I just saw what a tire mount and balance machine costs. Out here in the sticks its usually $10 for a fixed flat tire. A decent mount/balance machine costs well over $3000. Thats a lot of flat tires before the machine pays for itself. So I can't imagine a southern California shop not even wanting to bother with a patch. I can see they guy thinking about profit in his head. "Ok I can make $2 for a fix a flat job or I can make $40 on a new tire. I think I'll recoment the new tire." I would also bet dollars to donuts that the patch holds. I have two tires on my old truck with two patches in them each. Although they don't have sidewall damage like yours.

Ok, I'll add some two cents in here on all of these comments.
 
I live in suburban PA. My commute is 32 miles each way. 10 miles of stop lights and 20 miles of cruising at high speeds.
 
I drive a 2006 Honda Civic SI 6-spd.
 
So that's my profile before diving into this post.
 
I would say that 70-80% of MINIs I see around, both S and non-S, convertible and coupe, are manual transmissions. Very impressive. If based solely upon that fact, Edmunds made the right choice.
 
But there is more to choosing a manual trans for a long-term test than demographics. In a "Full Test" of an auto-equipped car, Edmunds will typically write something like, "Trans swaps gear easily and smoothly. Upshifts come frequently and early for economy reasons, but downshifts are a little delayed upon additional throttle application."
 
Now I can read that and pretty much know how that trans is going to operate for me. But a manual trans is a whole different beast. It breaks-in, the clutch mates to the car differently over 10,000 and even 20,000 miles and changes. How the car operates on a "full test" vs. how it operates over 20,000 miles and a handful of auto journalists is a whole different story.
 
So for me, everytime Edmunds gets a manual transmission on a long-term car it represents an opportunity to get insight into that car that is impossible in any other situation outside of ownership.
 
Regarding run-flats: Has anyone noticed that an abnormal number of run-flat owners get nails/screws pushed through their treads? If you've ever cruised a BMW website, it seems a very high amount get something within a short period of time. And, for once, a website is a representative sample as the owners are no more or less likely to get a nail in their tread if they are car enthusiasts or not.
 
Could the tire design somehow enhance the likelihood of puncture by road debris on run-flats?
 
Joe

The reason the first shop didn't want to patch the tire wasn't because it was a run-flat. The location of the nail was the important bit. I don't think it was just a sales pitch.
  
I've talked and worked with tire company engineers, and they'll say that ANY tire punctured in this area should be replaced, for the reason I mentioned in the original post - excessive deformation in this area as the tire rolls through the contact patch works the plug or patch too hard, causing it to fail. Where that line is drawn becomes a judgment call at the tire store. I actually agree with the first tire store's position.
  
But if a tire shop says they can't patch an RFT because it's a RFT, thats pure cattle excrement -- UNLESS you had the flat AND proceeded to drive the entire RFT range in an airless condition. These tires destroy their internals while giving you that range, and they can only do it once. Patching won't replace the damaged structure.
  
But in this case I never let the tire go flat. I put air back in and drove exactly zero miles with zero pressure. We brought it to the tire shop full of air. It was just a standard nail puncture and very slow leak.
  
The real hero of my story wasn't the RFT - it was the Tire Pressure Monitoring System. It alerted me soon enough that I was able to re-air the tire before I drove on it flat and get it fixed, saving me the cost of a new tire. The outcome would have been the same even if the Mini didn't have RFTs.

TireRack has Kumho 17 inch RFTs for $135 each. Might have been better off replacing two tires and then selling the one good RFT on craigslist?

They are the right size and load rating, but I would change all four, not two. Mismatching sets is never a good idea.
 
But we can't do that. In order to serve our readers, we need to test this car as Mini built it. We'll always use the OE-developed tire.

andrewinla, which Toyo Proxes do you have? I have the T1R (summer tires) on my Miata and they would be better than the Falken Ziex 512s, but only because the latter are all-seasons. Falken's hardcore tire is the Azenis and Miata drivers know it as the stickiest street tire we can use. (But it's hard, loud, and short lived, so few of us do.)
 
As for run flats, I'd rather pack a small spare if I'm going out on a trip too remote to depend on service. And even if you pay a lot of that rescue service, you still come out ahead, plus your daily drive is that much better.

+1 for Joe's comments.
 
Also, is there underfloor space for a spare in a Mini? Once we move back to Texas, a lot of our road trips involve being WAY out in the boondocks, and I wouldn't be comfortable running with no spare, runflats or not.

The regular cooper has room for a spare (and does not come with runflats) but the cooper S does not have room due to the center mounted exhaust. It looks like the upcoming MINI clubman will have a spare even in S trim because it has dual exhausts on either side of the car.

The new MINI was built from the factory with runflats in mind. Unless I'm absolutely speaking out of my arse (you know, gotta use the english slang when talking MINI), I don't think either the Cooper, Cooper S, or upcoming Clubman offer a spare tire.
 
One of the complaints with the original MINI (universal complaints) was the ride quality given the run-flat tires used. Well, one of the reasons for those complaints is that the MINI was built on the presumption of a spare and then at the last minute switched to run-flats. The new MINI used the presumption of run-flats from the beginning, and tuned their chassis/suspension according. Hence, the ride quality is substantially improved.
 
Any of the MINIs will accept a spare with the seats folded down :)
 
MINI might also be using solely run-flats as BMW seems to have bought a contract for run-flats from their tire vendors...
 
Joe